has broken game balance that rewards bad players
“why are higher skill players upset at current balancing?? I think it’s fine!”
It’s not an insult. But it does mean your statements about what takes relative skill are absolutely meaningless.
You cannot demonstrate you understand how to use a precision weapon, therefore you are not qualified to make statements about how much skill it does or not take to use relative to other weapons in the sandbox, because you do not know what you are talking about. You need to actually learn to be somewhat proficient at the game first.
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Looks like i kicked the hornets nest. Its crazy how easy these kids get offended over this game. Well, good day. People arent up for discussions its always an argument to them. Theyll grow up soon, hopefully.
Once again, if i am a bad player and you are a good player, you shouldnt be the one complaining about balance because you clearly have no issues killing enemy players with the super skillful BR. Oh and, by the fact you so actively try to transform this game into a halo 3 clone, it shows that you dont know what you are talking about. This is halo infinite not halo 3, the guns are fine and me having the ability to have fun in the game doesnt mean i suck at it or whatever you tell yourself. It means I have a good time using any gun in the game. You children seem to want every gun except the br to be useless because of this skill cult you made up.
I really don’t know how Halo fostered such a strong pro-AR fanbase. Whether it was doom or wolfenstein, or later medal of honor, call of duty or Halo campaigns, it’s nice to be accurate and kill things effectively.
Without even factoring multiplayer how prominent was the AR really? even during your first campaign playthrough you learn enemies without shields can get headshot and enemies with shields are best to be stripped with a plasma weapon then headshot. Even with the flood AR is a weak back-up, shotgun and plasma rifle do more, and it only becomes more irrelevant from CE.
What other automatics are as inaccurate and incapable as the Halo AR? Gears, CoD, Battlefield, Overwatch, Counterstrike, battle royale games etc, can’t think of one. Why do we keep polishing this turgid stool that keeps breaking weapon balance whenever it’s buffed, much more than just having both an AR start and BR start would, or AR/BR spawns.
Halo has always been a ‘1 gun game’, CE magnum, H2 BR, H3 BR, Reach DMR, H4 BR etc, the point is to have a sandbox which challenges the base gun. Not make the bad weapon the main gun and expect it to play fine. It wasn’t the communities fault that H2 - Reach had some weak or useless weapons, the dev decided that.
No other shooter game on the market has this problem as it hasn’t built a community that would defend an ineffective weapon to the death.
The reason it wasn’t an issue in previous games wasn’t due to the abundance of BRs but that BR starts in social were common and at least 50/50, so already much more abundant. Also the sniper wasn’t horrible and most maps had one, sometimes two with decently quick timers + carbine spawns, so headshot capable weapons on AR starts were a nudge more common but a lot more effective too.
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Says “the AR is too strong”
Also says “i am a very good player which implies i have no trouble against ARs”
“The BR takes skill”
While also complaining about player base dropping.
No matter how skillful the br is or how nooby the ar is, there needs to be a stepping stone for new players. If you shove a newb in a game where every other player is a HCS pro million dollar champion but little jimmy hanst played halo in his life, not only will he do very badly being forced to use the most demanding weapons in the game, little timmy would also be bullied for it. Its similar in another game i play where there was so much content power creep that if a new player started he would be years behind everyone else. And the veterans in the game commit to griefing those new players.
So, the AR being a good weapon isnt a bad thing. The BR clearly being a better weapon, but it is more demanding, those players have to start somewhere.
This is a community forum. Someone having a different opinion doesnt mean they suck at the game. And you dont have to be a high ranked tryhard to be able to post here. Sorry you got so angry over it, but 343 shouldnt cater to rank tryhards who havnt grown up from halo 3 and think that a guns effectiveness should be determined by some skill cult who try to dictate how demanding a weapon is.
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Good players identify balance problems far more quickly and far more accurately than bad players. For bad players, their biggest problem is usually that they are bad, not that something is unbalanced. This makes it difficult for them to discern balance issues in general, and it is why bad players make total nonsense arguments like “the BR and AR take the same amount of skill”. They don’t understand the game and they don’t know what they are talking about on these matters.
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Even if it were true that good players should not complain about balance, you are still spouting nonsense, because I am not complaining here or anywhere else on this forum about Halo Infinite’s balance.
- You are continuing to talk absolute nonsense. I don’t know why you think I’m trying to turn this into a “Halo 3 clone” when I have argued several different times on this forum that I think Infinite has potential to be better than Halo 3. I would argue that AR starts are worse than BR starts in Infinite, but (insert shock and awe)… the game includes playlists with both settings so that people can play what they like.
- … as per the above, you might want to re-think which one of us doesn’t know what they are talking about
Of course your ability to have fun doesn’t mean you suck. Your service record is what speaks to that. Which again, doesn’t matter except insofar as it undermines your opinions on game skill and balance.
Sorry to break it to you child, but just because i disagree with you doesnt mean i suck. I can post here all i want to and you can whine about my stats, it doesnt make my opinions any less valid than yours. You remind me of this guy in another game. He thought he owned the community forums through harassing people who post suggestions. Saying that if they dont have 2 thousand hours playing the game their opinion didnt matter. If you want an echo chamber you should make a discord or a site where if someone has a different opinion they get banned. You obviously have a hard time here seeing how someones opinion makes you this angry. Id like to stress it again that i play the game for fun, as does the majority of players. Just because you and some skill cult think that a weapon should be nerfed or buffed doesnt speak for the entire community. So do you want to DISCUSS about the balance of the game, or are you gonna keep whining and insulting my stats?
Of course you disagreeing doesn’t mean you suck. Your service record says you suck. And yeah… it does invalidate your opinions on skill and balance.
It’s like a high school quarterback arguing with an NFL quarterback about what the hardest skill sets to master are for being a quarterback.
If you want to believe it or not you dont get to control the forums based on a players stats.
For comparison,
“This guy doenst make enough money per year, he has no say in this.”
“This person weighs too much, they have no say in this.”
“This person doesnt own a car, he has no say in this.”
So, I can post on this forum whenever I like, and you can cry about my stats. Sorry 343 isnt gonna cater to some mob mentality, 343 isnt gonna hold your hand through all this and doom a piece of contents usefulness because you think it takes no skill. If my opinions make you this mad then we can do this all day, lets start with this-
The BR takes no skill to use and should be nerfed.
Now start crying.
No this is like the NFL quarterback trying to lecture all of the world on how to play backyard football and what the best rules are for it. Halo is a video game not a professional sport. Now if they want different rules for professional Halo go for it but don’t make us all suffer with a bad meta for it.
“Pros/good players lover the BR” proves nothing. It means they got used to how it plays and don’t want to have to relearn a games balance. People love to use OP guns, in any other shooter if a gun is OP everyone makes a loadout with it. That’s what the BR used to be. It is now perfect as a map weapon. Also just because you play ranked/have higher stats doesn’t necessarily make you a better player.
Many people like me are willing to drive a warthog or carry a flag. People like you only do it if necessary but won’t be the first to do so. You will sit back to try to pad your KD and the difference in play from BTB and 4v4 isn’t even comparable. You could be great at 4v4 but can’t handle vehicles and the amount of people in BTB so you play ranked. This might lead you to think the BR is fine because you get used to it being OP and not having to worry so much about map weapons. Now you play BTB there are 3 times the players and they have ARs that for the first time in 20 years don’t suck. Yeah I understand why you are irritated.
Now again both guns have to aim, one has a bunch of hindrances on it and one is a perfectly accurate long range laser and you are trying to tell me the laser takes more skill. It’s ridiculous that you don’t understand there are more skills in games than just aiming, there is positioning, knowing what weapon the enemy has, knowing if you are in effective range, controlling recoil (of which the BR doesn’t have), have to know if you even have enough in the mag to get the kill (again the BR can get more kills per mag than the AR) and I could go on.
The BR has ONE single aspect of it that is marginally more difficult to use than the AR which is aiming and that really only applies when the target is close and its a bit more difficultto track them. Other than that all the other skill requirements go to the AR. I’m not put here saying it’s super high skill, honestly Halo is one of the easier games to play when compared to other competitive shooters but saying the BR takes so much skill therefor we must have it all the time is just a blatant lie.
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two terrible players who can’t use the BR arguing that the BR doesn’t take more skill than the AR
oh man… you guys are hilarious 
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If it does take more skill it’s marginally. That’s not the problem we have with it. The problem we have is that the BR is OP if you are even decent with it.
But you cry all you want because it doesn’t seem 343 cares to cater “if I don’t have a BR in my hands 24/7 I’m going to cry Halo is too easy”.
It is very poor design for an Arena shooter to have a gun that is so good you can compete with most map weapons. No other arena shooter has this and most start you off with terrible weapons. The AR in Infinite isn’t as OP as the BR/DMR used to be but it is good enough tonget you by. You don’t want Halo, you want a BR dominated game in a Halo skin.
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Sounds like a final effort to insult players stats over their opinions on the game. Because whoever wins the HCS gets to make all game balance decisions. If that player gets stomped on by a catboy using a pulse carbine, then he gets to whine and complain and get the gun either nerfed to uselessness or removed entirely. Hu hu hu hu hu hu
Oh that is so me!
You have no idea how many enemy flag returns I witnessed because nobody in my team bothered scoring with a flag that I brought within 10 yards of the goal. They all went after kills but somehow totally failed the objective.
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The fact that Auto starts don’t work has nothing to do with whether any individual AR is weak or strong, its that it is inherently limited(even infinites) in terms of range which makes it trivially easy to exploit fresh spawns who have no ranged options.
As for Infinite is a complete mess for a variety of reasons and needs a top to bottom overhaul, but once again we run up against the claims that Infinite has a “good sandbox” but apparently that balance would fall apart if we were to spawn people with one of the worst BR’s in the series.
And here we are once again running up against insanely hyperbolic ahistorical nonsense claims that precision starts have been better than “99.99% of the other guns.” Its always been a minority of weapons that failed to have anything to offer, but you all have a meltdown if people don’t pick up any number of badly designed redundant bullet hoses.
You don’t care about having a good sandbox, or good gameplay, you just care about superficial variety with as many pretty lights an colors as possible. You have no interest in making those weapons that people ignored in favor of a precision weapon better or more compelling to use.
A weapon that requires precision with a small reticle is in fact more difficult that lining up those same “easy slow targets” with a gigantic reticle with random bloom. This isn’t a debate. Now Infinite and honestly most other Halo games precision weapons are infact too easy to use because of heavy aim assist and hitscan projectiles, but they are still fundamentally more difficult to use that any given bullet hose. If those precision weapons are too easy(and they are mind you but that doesn’t change the fact they are still better for gameplay), then by extension it makes most of those weapons you complain about people not using have no skill gap whatsoever.
Small reticles, accurate(relatively speaking) with less(though obviously not ideal) aim assist are in fact going to be more difficult to use that a random bullet hose with a large reticle. The Halo Infinite sandbox, BR and AR included are really bad, but a versatile precision weapon is always going to provide a more compelling experience than running around with a bullet hose.
If you want to play in a Halo match where all weapons get used whether or not they offer any unique or compelling gameplay then you will always have fiesta. Because ranged weapons will always dominate the Halo “meta” whether you spawn with one or not unless you fundamentally change what Halo is. The precision weapon “meta” is core to Halo’s identity, but AR stans just don’t want to accept that fact. There is always some secret majority of people who actually hated Precision starts despite this alleged majority utterly failing to show up/stick around for Infinite’s “good sandbox.”
There is always some excuse for why more people enjoyed those original games besides players finding the gameplay compelling “OP” Pistol/BR and all.
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This is the “don’t believe your lying eyes argument”. We have all seen gameplay or even played with BR spawns. They hurt variety for most weapons outside a select few. Infinites AR has enough range to not be useless but doesn’t allow you to out range everything but a sniper and the stalker rifle.
Infinite doesn’t have a redundant sandbox, I can’t think of 2 guns that function so similarly one needs to be removed. Maybe the heatwave is the only one but it still has unique properties a Bulldog doesn’t.
Again your claim that the BR is leagues harder to use than the AR only comes down to aiming at relatively easy to hit targets. It doesn’t take into account all the other factors like other map guns that are better than the AR at close range or the guns that can out range the AR or recoil or bloom affecting your shot at anything outside of close range. The AR has almost perfectly middle range which allows it to not be OP but still useful. The BR, especially in previous Halos, doesn’t have much of anything else to worry about because it is too useful. That’s why people should have to fight over them on the map.
Don’t go to the, “we’ll then whoever picks it up dominates the whole other team” because that doesn’t happen due to the lower ammo count you have. If you spawn with a BR you effectively have infinite ammo (due to every body having one on it when they die) on a gun with long range, laser accuracy, high bullet velocity, really low recoil, no bloom, a mag large enough to take down multiple Spartans, no penalty to hip fire, a good zoom, and that in previous titles beats the AR even at close range. Yup the BR takes soooooooo much skill you must be busting at the seams with skill if you can even get a single kill with it.
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You know sometimes i wonder, do the players who claim to be pros, only have such high kd and accuracy, is because they only use the br. Someones accuracy shouldnt be a factor in if someones opinion matters. Because weapons like ar, by design will miss shots. Guns that do not require a direct hit to kill would probably lower accuracy stat but im not 100% certain. But the br has high accuracy so its hard to miss in the first place, higher damage, lower rate of fire so there is less potentially missed shots. But the AR has high rate of fire, low accuracy, low damage, so players are going to have low accuracy stats unless they use exclusively precision weapons like the BR. Point being, the rant that guy had a while ago about how stats dictate if you have a say in anything is absolute bs. Yeah, if you use br and only br you would have higher accuracy. Which probably supports my argument in that, players who use the br defend the br, and to them the only people that have a say in anything are people who have a high accuracy by using the br.
BR’s don’t hurt variety badly designed and balanced weapons remove themselves from the equation. Again if your sandbox can’t handle spawning with one of the worst BR’s then those weapons never had anything of value to begin with.
The Mangler is just a better Sidekick, the heatwaves quirks amount to nothing, the disruptor is just the stolen EMP function of a plasma pistol, but redundancy aside, Infinite’s sandbox still sucks for a variety of reasons, too much aim assist, too much RNG, too many hitscan weapons, current “balance” rewards low skill weapons like the AR rather than weapons that require precision and in many cases mechanics actively harm the skill gap. For every interesting mechanic that gets added its almost immediately undermined by some other aspect of its design, see Heatwave or Cindershot. The Halo Infinite sandbox is almost insidiously bad.
The redundancy comments were a response to the notion of past Halo games being “one gun” when by “one gun” you actually mean "people are not using a minority brainless reskin bullet hoses or BR clones like the Carbine. "
Did I claim it was “leagues” more difficult? No, but a precision weapon like the BR will always be fundamentally more difficult to use than the AR and using an AR outside its intended range does not make it a high skill weapon. The AR OP relative to the skill requirement it takes to use it, “OP or not OP” is not the deciding factor as to what makes a good starting weapon in Halo.
There is nowhere to “go” that is just demonstrably what happens in an auto start Halo game. Versatility will always be sought after and the team that controls those weapons controls the game and it takes very little effort to play around a fresh spawn who’s only option is to engage at close range. But I guess I shouldn’t believe my lying eyes right?
You can throw out hyperbole all you want, it still isn’t going to make your RNG bullet hose take more skill to use than an accuracy based precision weapon. That said, Infinite’s BR is in fact too easy to use(most weapons in Infinite are too easy to use), its projectiles should be projectiles not psuedo hitscan, aim assist and magnetism should be significantly lower, it shouldn’t even have recoil because it gives away easy headshots when you aim at the chest.
The fact that the Halo Infinite BR is easy to use, as is the rest of the sandbox, doesn’t change the fact that it is still A.)Still requires more skill than the AR and B.)Versatile skill based starting weapons will always be better for Halo gameplay. Again, you don’t actually care about gameplay, you care about hitting some arbitrary use quotas regardless of merit. It doesn’t matter if the game becomes a mindless bullet hose fest or end up with incredibly shallow rock paper scissors gameplay. Its all about “variety” at any cost, style over substance.
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