Anyone remember the all the hate on Bloom?? Particularly on the DMR?
Well…the new thing to complain about is hating on the OP’ed DMR, and among other things but that is neither here nor there.
Well now you see WHY bloom was implemented on the DMR in Halo Reach, to CURB the power it had.
And with the bloom almost non-existent and negligible, it is basically a sniper.
Understand now why it was added with such a high rate of bloom in Halo Reach?
Does not follow.
Just because the DMR is OP in its current state in H4 (it is) doesn’t mean that upping the bloom on the weapon is the best solution (it’s not).
There are any number of other measures that can be taken, but the addition of another randomizing element to the game is not the best one.
It was a bad design then; it would be a bad design now, too.
Ilike the idea of blooming reticle to slow down players shots, but I dont like it causing insanely random shot spread.
Halo needs a DMR bloom feature that does not alter the bullet pattern.
-small fyi I use the DMR-
IIRC, the only loadout weapons that don’t have bloom are the BR, LR, and Carbine. Bloom is still very much alive, yet oh so negligable on anything but an automatic weapon.
Halo does not need bloom. It is not the best way to balance anything.
I don’t mind it being on the DMR as it is and only as it is now, where it means very little if anything, but making that, of all things, affect someone’s gameplay is an atrocious idea.
Just lower the damage or fire rate, or make it pink and purple, or do ANYTHING other than add more serious bloom.
> Does not follow.
>
> Just because the DMR is OP in its current state in H4 (it is) doesn’t mean that upping the bloom on the weapon is the best solution (it’s not).
>
> There are any number of other measures that can be taken, but the addition of another randomizing element to the game is not the best one.
>
> It was a bad design then; it would be a bad design now, too.
I don’t care honestly, this was more geared towards all the haters, but anyway the Gun itself is a problem, it should be treated as a power weapon or it should be massively nerfed.
Just a thought.
> IIRC, the only loadout weapons that don’t have bloom are the BR, LR, and Carbine. Bloom is still very much alive, yet oh so negligable on anything but an automatic weapon.
Well on automatic weapons thats a given. And the carbine, LR, and BR all work without it because of their own “handicaps” if i may, hence i think bloom should be the DMR’s “handicap”
Is flinch the new bloom?
> Is flinch the new bloom?
Flinch is the new de-scoping.
I love bloom, I think it adds an extra layer of skill and variety to the weapons. The problem was that a lot of people didn’t want to learn how to play the game agian, instead jumping into Reach hoping the skills they developers in Halo 3 could help them get to level 50 faster.
At the moment all the weapons feel the same. You can argue that one weapon kills 0.2 seconds faster then another, but really it doesn’t make a difference. Bloom could have added variety to the weapons. A simple way to alter the guns would be to make stronger weapons have more bloom. Like, the Carbine is the weakest, but the bloom isn’t that much, while the DMR is the strongest, but has large amounts of bloom, and the BR is sitting in the center, with burst fire it increases the amount of damage you can deal, but the bloom expands quickly.
But even then that’s kinda borked. Because why would a single fire weapon have more bloom then a burst fire weapon?
Bloom wouldn’t solve the DMR’s power issues.
Its needs much longer reload time (somewhere 1.5x to 2x as long as it has now) and to have a slightly lower RoF.
That would make the BR/Carbine/Light Rifle to compete for king of mid-close range combat, while still leaving the DMR as the king of long-range combat.
> I love bloom, I think it adds an extra layer of skill and variety to the weapons. The problem was that a lot of people didn’t want to learn how to play the game agian, instead jumping into Reach hoping the skills they developers in Halo 3 could help them get to level 50 faster.
>
> At the moment all the weapons feel the same. You can argue that one weapon kills 0.2 seconds faster then another, but really it doesn’t make a difference. Bloom could have added variety to the weapons. A simple way to alter the guns would be to make stronger weapons have more bloom. Like, the Carbine is the weakest, but the bloom isn’t that much, while the DMR is the strongest, but has large amounts of bloom, and the BR is sitting in the center, with burst fire it increases the amount of damage you can deal, but the bloom expands quickly.
>
> But even then that’s kinda borked. Because why would a single fire weapon have more bloom then a burst fire weapon?
I think the DMR is in a rut that it can’t get out of. To be realistic on gameplay would make the DMR the KING, but to make it gameplay wise balanced, it would have to either have a)bloom b)long reload times c)a damage decrease overall.
All these though show how much of a bad weapon the community had made it into because of the controversial bloom not being wanted back.
Giving the DMR more bloom won’t solve its problems. It would just hamper its long-range effectiveness and essentially turn it into a BR clone without addressing the issue of its insane close-range effectivness. In fact, bloom would probably help the DMR more in close range.
It really just needs a ROF nerf. Make it slower than the BR, that way the DMR would be better at long range and worse at mid-close, which is how it should be. Also, I’d like to see its mag size reduced back to the original 12 from the beta. The BR has 36 rounds (12 bursts) and it’s a five shot kill, so it would make them even more balanced with each other.
Im not saying bring back bloom, but I’m surprised there aren’t more people raving mad about the flinch and recoil on this game. Everyone blew a gasket about bloom when Reach came out but there hasn’t been an uproar on the evilness that is Flinch and Recoil. Talk about random, not if you get shot your reticule goes all over the place, combine that with the recoil that you have and your whole screen is moving disproportionately from where you are trying to aim. Never before has there been something on a Halo game that made you loose so much control of where you were aiming.
Take out a BR or DMR and fire it when no one is around, watch your screen the screen bounces up and down, this is recoil. Now these Spartans should be able to control recoil they are muscular soldiers that have upgraded skeletal frames and are in huge combat suits, master chief never had a problem with recoil, not only is this a problem, real recoil means the gun bounces up and your sights go with it, on HALO 4 the entire screen bounces, meaning somehow the Spartan’s head is going up and down when he shoots the weapon.
Recoil plus flinch make it to where your screen is bouncing around all over the place, this is a horrible element to have to the game. It takes so much control away from the player, this was not in any previous Halo game but is something out of call of duty. 343 needs to remove these elements completely from the game with the next title update. I am not buying any more maps unless major changes like these are implemented in the next title update, as long as I can get a game on Reach I will be playing that. The lag on HALO 4 almost makes it impossible to play anyway.
“Everyone blew a gasket about bloom when Reach came out but there hasn’t been an uproar on the evilness that is Flinch and Recoil. Talk about random, not if you get shot your reticule goes all over the place, combine that with the recoil that you have and your whole screen is moving disproportionately from where you are trying to aim”
Flinch and recoil are both perfectly manageable and predictable. I don’t mind either one of them, they’re a way to do what bloom wanted to do without frustrating players and destroying the weapons it featured most on. Flinch is a bit excessive when you get hit by a Snipe, but it’s a Snipe, that’s rare AND it’s an inoffensive mechanic as far as other weapons go. I don’t mind either flinch or recoil.
“Never before has there been something on a Halo game that made you loose so much control of where you were aiming”.
Uh. I think they called that ‘bloom’ in Reach.
> <mark>I love bloom, I think it adds an extra layer of skill and variety to the weapons. The problem was that a lot of people didn’t want to learn how to play the game agian, instead jumping into Reach hoping the skills they developers in Halo 3 could help them get to level 50 faster.</mark>
>
> At the moment all the weapons feel the same. You can argue that one weapon kills 0.2 seconds faster then another, but really it doesn’t make a difference. Bloom could have added variety to the weapons. A simple way to alter the guns would be to make stronger weapons have more bloom. Like, the Carbine is the weakest, but the bloom isn’t that much, while the DMR is the strongest, but has large amounts of bloom, and the BR is sitting in the center, with burst fire it increases the amount of damage you can deal, but the bloom expands quickly.
>
> But even then that’s kinda borked. Because why would a single fire weapon have more bloom then a burst fire weapon?
You hit the nail exactly on the head.
10/10. I’m not even kidding.
The only thing that makes the DMR overpowered in some situations is this flinch -Yoink-. Descoping kept the DMR balanced and made ranged fights require skill.
Now, everyone can hit 5 shots so unless you get first shot you have no chance of winning.
> > <mark>I love bloom, I think it adds an extra layer of skill and variety to the weapons. The problem was that a lot of people didn’t want to learn how to play the game agian, instead jumping into Reach hoping the skills they developers in Halo 3 could help them get to level 50 faster.</mark>
> > more bloom then a burst fire weapon?
>
> You hit the nail exactly on the head.
>
> 10/10. I’m not even kidding.
In no way, shape or form did bloom add any sort of skill to shooting in Reach. It was hated because it was broken.
Did you ever wonder why it was the best of the best that hated bloom? Did you ever wonder why good players spammed 90% of the time?
You can have your “opinions” but it’s not an opinion when it directly contradicts facts.
> > <mark>I love bloom, I think it adds an extra layer of skill and variety to the weapons. The problem was that a lot of people didn’t want to learn how to play the game agian, instead jumping into Reach hoping the skills they developers in Halo 3 could help them get to level 50 faster.</mark>
>
> You hit the nail exactly on the head.
>
> 10/10. I’m not even kidding.
'Thall due respect, pressing a button at short regular intervals doesn’t take much skill… especially when there are visual and audio cues as to the rhythm. :\
That said, I think that selectively-applied bloom could help to balance the DMR. So make it bloom wildly when unscoped, but make it bloom normally when scoped. Make sure that scoping in temporarily disables bloom without actually resetting it, so that people can’t force quicker resets.
That’ll heavily nerf it at close range, without affecting its function at the ranges it was meant to be used at.
I don’t like saying this, but 343i is at fault only for listening to all of you who complained about the original Reach DMR’s bloom without EVER giving it a good thought as to why it even got it in the first place. You all have yourselves to blame for this, and what’s worse is the rediculous aim assistance that stupid gun has. I thought I never seen it be more broken than the MLG version 7’s DMR on Reach (that had no bloom)but no it was just too good to keep it that way. Now I’m experiencing being able to headshot others in Halo 4 with the DMR without actually aiming at the head, without pacing shots, without zooming it, and especially without worrying if the guy is getting away! I had experienced getting headshot kills 2 seconds after I made the hit MUCH more often than ever before. How would I know that? Simple, because it is hitscan, the hit doesn’t register until whenever it decides to thanks to the hosts’, servers’, or even my own shity connections, with the addition of dieing myself before the guy I headshoted died, and in some cases, when the guy had also retreated down a ramp to where I can’t shoot him, but I don’t need to worry about that, because, again, I shot him a couple a seconds before all I have to do is wait for the hitscan to finally register.
Geeze it is so easy! How can anyone think they are skilled at the game while they use the gun 343i and the whiney feedback from Reach created just for -Yoinks!- to use! This is like broken lasertag with extra LARGE lasers.
What the -Yoink- happened to CONTROL=SKILL ???
I want Reach bloom back as much as Uncaged to return as a Forge Map.
Which is to say, not very much. Bungie was working under the false assumption that tapping your finger in a rhythm took skill. Not only was it easy to master, it slowed the gameplay down too.
To nerf the DMR in Halo 4 will not require bloom increase. Slight ROF nerf and recoil will do IMO.