This game requires a viable unit to combat air units. In the original game, wolverines did a decent job at countering air units. However, the current wolverines or reavers are merely too slow.
Hornets and banshees can fly around the map destroying bases whilst the wolverines or reavers desperately try to catch them. You might suggest leader powers, but air units can dodge a lot of the powers.
If this game is to retain a label of RTS, then please provide some anti-air options.
Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground! #RIP Air Units
> 2535422421305993;3:
> Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> #RIP Air Units
I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
> 2533274847730244;4:
> > 2535422421305993;3:
> > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > #RIP Air Units
>
> I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
> 2533274927740213;5:
> > 2533274847730244;4:
> > > 2535422421305993;3:
> > > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > > #RIP Air Units
> >
> > I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
>
> Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
>
> As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
Yes, but mass Air would definetly wreck mass AA, I could handle mass Air with core Infantry, which I find kind of dumb because I don’t think that a core unit should perform better than a counter. And again the DPS buff is not even 10%, the big buff is for their AOE, Vulture got a buff and Blisterback isn’t mean to be fighting on air, meaning that only large groups of core air/healers will be punished.
> 2533274847730244;6:
> > 2533274927740213;5:
> > > 2533274847730244;4:
> > > > 2535422421305993;3:
> > > > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > > > #RIP Air Units
> > >
> > > I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
> >
> > Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
> >
> > As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
>
> Yes, but mass Air would definetly wreck mass AA, I could handle mass Air with core Infantry, which I find kind of dumb because I don’t think that a core unit should perform better than a counter. And again the DPS buff is not even 10%, the big buff is for their AOE, Vulture got a buff and Blisterback isn’t mean to be fighting on air, meaning that only large groups of core air/healers will be punished.
Except air spam couldn’t beat AA, not only have I seen this in game play but additionally in testing. 8 Wolverines and the rest of your pop as Warthogs could kill full pop Banshees only suffering minimal casualties. With these buffs you won’t even need 8, making Air too easy to be countered and next to worthless.
> 2533274927740213;7:
> > 2533274847730244;6:
> > > 2533274927740213;5:
> > > > 2533274847730244;4:
> > > > > 2535422421305993;3:
> > > > > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > > > > #RIP Air Units
> > > >
> > > > I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
> > >
> > > Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
> > >
> > > As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
> >
> > Yes, but mass Air would definetly wreck mass AA, I could handle mass Air with core Infantry, which I find kind of dumb because I don’t think that a core unit should perform better than a counter. And again the DPS buff is not even 10%, the big buff is for their AOE, Vulture got a buff and Blisterback isn’t mean to be fighting on air, meaning that only large groups of core air/healers will be punished.
>
> Except air spam couldn’t beat AA, not only have I seen this in game play but additionally in testing. 8 Wolverines and the rest of your pop as Warthogs could kill full pop Banshees only suffering minimal casualties. With these buffs you won’t even need 8, making Air too easy to be countered and next to worthless.
Banshees got a nerf last time and I don’t see that spam any longer (unless it’s Decimus or Colony) Hornets and Sentinels didn’t got any nerf when Banshees did, those still take over AA and I think that even the guy on the vs videos said AA wasn’t performing well. As for the Banshees, Shroud has a crazy buff, I think it can compensate for Banshee’s bad performance.
> 2533274847730244;6:
> > 2533274927740213;5:
> > > 2533274847730244;4:
> > > > 2535422421305993;3:
> > > > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > > > #RIP Air Units
> > >
> > > I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
> >
> > Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
> >
> > As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
>
> Yes, but mass Air would definetly wreck mass AA, I could handle mass Air with core Infantry, which I find kind of dumb because I don’t think that a core unit should perform better than a counter. And again the DPS buff is not even 10%, the big buff is for their AOE, Vulture got a buff and Blisterback isn’t mean to be fighting on air, meaning that only large groups of core air/healers will be punished.
Mass air does not wreck mass AA. I will gladly test this with you. I’m getting really tired of people making stupid, unfounded statements like these and not actually testing them.
Also, that DPS buff is huge. Precent increases are proportional to the original number and AA already did massive damage to air. And vultures only got buffed in their damage against bases. They were already some of the most fragile units in the game and now they’ll be completely unviable because 4 wolves will kill a full pop of them.
i think they should just have a tech 3 upgrade for AA to make them a little stronger, if you make them stronger without an upgrade they may be too powerful early in the game. Just saying tho, I usually dont have a problem with air until theres nothing but it with healers mixed in, When I have used wolverines, gales, and marines together i can usually do a lot of damage to air, especially when my teammates are being effective too, but you cant just sit there and wait for it to happen.
> 2533274814970819;10:
> > 2533274847730244;6:
> > > 2533274927740213;5:
> > > > 2533274847730244;4:
> > > > > 2535422421305993;3:
> > > > > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > > > > #RIP Air Units
> > > >
> > > > I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
> > >
> > > Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
> > >
> > > As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
> >
> > Yes, but mass Air would definetly wreck mass AA, I could handle mass Air with core Infantry, which I find kind of dumb because I don’t think that a core unit should perform better than a counter. And again the DPS buff is not even 10%, the big buff is for their AOE, Vulture got a buff and Blisterback isn’t mean to be fighting on air, meaning that only large groups of core air/healers will be punished.
>
> Mass air does not wreck mass AA. I will gladly test this with you. I’m getting really tired of people making stupid, unfounded statements like these and not actually testing them.
>
> Also, that DPS buff is huge. Precent increases are proportional to the original number and AA already did massive damage to air. And vultures only got buffed in their damage against bases. They were already some of the most fragile units in the game and now they’ll be completely unviable because 4 wolves will kill a full pop of them.
Alright, give me a couple of hours and I’ll test that (vs Hornets) as my friends went to other games I don’t test that, but I play randoms and when I get noobs I can’t prevent a dude from going full Hornets, and as I said, AA loses.
4 Wolves killing full pop Vulture? Forgive me dude, that’s over reacting.
> 2533274847730244;12:
> > 2533274814970819;10:
> > > 2533274847730244;6:
> > > > 2533274927740213;5:
> > > > > 2533274847730244;4:
> > > > > > 2535422421305993;3:
> > > > > > Why do only bad players complain about AA(Not directed to anyone specific), I really hope 343 can see that any player that is decent, not great just decent can handle air. Now they shall buff AA and air will be useless and we will only be left with ground units. Huray a RTS-Labeled game that has only ground!
> > > > > > #RIP Air Units
> > > > >
> > > > > I think you “pro” players are over reacting the AA buff, Air can’t be hit by seige/Mega Turrets, or mines, it’s also hard to hit them with a Leader Power, besides, the buff is an AOE that specifically says is meant to deal groups of air, if you really don’t mass air, them you have nothing to worry about. So stop whining about the buff.
> > > >
> > > > Except that air was already situational, and now it will be worthless.
> > > >
> > > > As for the OP’s statement, wait till this week and you’ll never have to worry about air again (even though you never needed too)
> > >
> > > Yes, but mass Air would definetly wreck mass AA, I could handle mass Air with core Infantry, which I find kind of dumb because I don’t think that a core unit should perform better than a counter. And again the DPS buff is not even 10%, the big buff is for their AOE, Vulture got a buff and Blisterback isn’t mean to be fighting on air, meaning that only large groups of core air/healers will be punished.
> >
> > Mass air does not wreck mass AA. I will gladly test this with you. I’m getting really tired of people making stupid, unfounded statements like these and not actually testing them.
> >
> > Also, that DPS buff is huge. Precent increases are proportional to the original number and AA already did massive damage to air. And vultures only got buffed in their damage against bases. They were already some of the most fragile units in the game and now they’ll be completely unviable because 4 wolves will kill a full pop of them.
>
> Alright, give me a couple of hours and I’ll test that (vs Hornets) as my friends went to other games I don’t test that, but I play randoms and when I get noobs I can’t prevent a dude from going full Hornets, and as I said, AA loses.
Sounds good. I’ll be happy to demonstrate that air was already in a weak position.
> 2535452145368480;1:
> Dear 343 & Creative Assembly,
>
> This game requires a viable unit to combat air units. In the original game, wolverines did a decent job at countering air units. However, the current wolverines or reavers are merely too slow.
>
> Hornets and banshees can fly around the map destroying bases whilst the wolverines or reavers desperately try to catch them. You might suggest leader powers, but air units can dodge a lot of the powers.
>
> If this game is to retain a label of RTS, then please provide some anti-air options.
I did testing and air does not beat its counters in an engagement. I have no idea how you could be making your claims because you have not posted a video for evidence. Explain the exact situation that you are talking about and don’t confuse “your army getting hit with a nuke before the Air came in” as AA being ineffective. Also, if your playing 1s, how did you let him get full pop air. You can only start building air at the 4:30/5 min mark if you actually committed anything to a early game army. They build slow and are very draining on your blue. If you are trying to mass air, you are not expanding for this very reason. Please just don’t respond with “but I lost and the other person was air so air is OP” because that kind of group think honestly ruined 1/3 of the unit triangle for the next patch.
This is starting to piss me off. Same thing different day. AIR IS WEAK TO AA. hard to Imagine right? believe it. I have the same math from a post from yesterday about the costs so i’ll type it down again. Reavers cost 175s/225e to total 4200s/5400e for 120. A wolf costs 150s/190e to cost a total of 4500s/5700e. A Hornet costs 325s/0e to costs a total of 9750s/0e and it’s Banished counterpart, the Banshee, costs 300s/0e to cost a total of 12000s/0e. If you add the cheapest AA and cheapest air resources, it cost 150 less resources. Heres the catch. YOU DON’T NEED 120 POP OF ANTI-AIR TO BEAT MASS AIR. A simple investment of 8 Reavers and 8-10 Wolverines or 40 pop will suffice with core infantry or Marauder or Warhog mix.
Here is a few downsides too massing air:
You must build more supply pads than generators.
They are T2 and thus hard to produce early with their also high costs
Harder time controlling powernodes
With less power, they also generate Leader Points slower
Easy to be killed by cheap core Infantry which is also faster to build and can be massed far earlier than air.
Harder to transition from air to something with power with high supply pad requirements
There are also few but fewer advantages:
Manueverability
very quick
Counters some vehicles
Overall, air is garbage and its upsides are outweighed by it’s downsides. Too even get the simple idea air is OP is far from the truth so if you see someone is building lots of air, this takes time and resources and if you are agressive, you will never have air as a issue.
> 2535428931727626;15:
> This is starting to piss me off. Same thing different day. AIR IS WEAK TO AA. hard to Imagine right? believe it. I have the same math from a post from yesterday about the costs so i’ll type it down again. Reavers cost 175s/225e to total 4200s/5400e for 120. A wolf costs 150s/190e to cost a total of 4500s/5700e. A Hornet costs 325s/0e to costs a total of 9750s/0e and it’s Banished counterpart, the Banshee, costs 300s/0e to cost a total of 12000s/0e. If you add the cheapest AA and cheapest air resources, it cost 150 less resources. Heres the catch. YOU DON’T NEED 120 POP OF ANTI-AIR TO BEAT MASS AIR. A simple investment of 8 Reavers and 8-10 Wolverines or 40 pop will suffice with core infantry or Marauder or Warhog mix.
>
> Here is a few downsides too massing air:
> You must build more supply pads than generators.
> They are T2 and thus hard to produce early with their also high costs
> Harder time controlling powernodes
> With less power, they also generate Leader Points slower
> Easy to be killed by cheap core Infantry which is also faster to build and can be massed far earlier than air.
> Harder to transition from air to something with power with high supply pad requirements
>
> There are also few but fewer advantages:
>
> Manueverability
> very quick
> Counters some vehicles
>
> Overall, air is garbage and its upsides are outweighed by it’s downsides. Too even get the simple idea air is OP is far from the truth so if you see someone is building lots of air, this takes time and resources and if you are agressive, you will never have air as a issue.
There mobility is a huge advantage though that makes up their weakness . hit and run tactics
The AA change needs to not go through, it would make air completely useless. Air is already the most expensive unit in the game and easily loses to anti air. With the change to splash damage it will now enable small groups of anti air to kill full pops, if every time my 8 reavers shoot a volley it kills 5 banshees that is way too cost effective.
> 2533274859484857;17:
> > 2535428931727626;15:
> > This is starting to piss me off. Same thing different day. AIR IS WEAK TO AA. hard to Imagine right? believe it. I have the same math from a post from yesterday about the costs so i’ll type it down again. Reavers cost 175s/225e to total 4200s/5400e for 120. A wolf costs 150s/190e to cost a total of 4500s/5700e. A Hornet costs 325s/0e to costs a total of 9750s/0e and it’s Banished counterpart, the Banshee, costs 300s/0e to cost a total of 12000s/0e. If you add the cheapest AA and cheapest air resources, it cost 150 less resources. Heres the catch. YOU DON’T NEED 120 POP OF ANTI-AIR TO BEAT MASS AIR. A simple investment of 8 Reavers and 8-10 Wolverines or 40 pop will suffice with core infantry or Marauder or Warhog mix.
> >
> > Here is a few downsides too massing air:
> > You must build more supply pads than generators.
> > They are T2 and thus hard to produce early with their also high costs
> > Harder time controlling powernodes
> > With less power, they also generate Leader Points slower
> > Easy to be killed by cheap core Infantry which is also faster to build and can be massed far earlier than air.
> > Harder to transition from air to something with power with high supply pad requirements
> >
> > There are also few but fewer advantages:
> >
> > Manueverability
> > very quick
> > Counters some vehicles
> >
> > Overall, air is garbage and its upsides are outweighed by it’s downsides. Too even get the simple idea air is OP is far from the truth so if you see someone is building lots of air, this takes time and resources and if you are agressive, you will never have air as a issue.
>
> There mobility is a huge advantage though that makes up their weakness . hit and run tactics
Mobility is still not a issue with scouting but i’ll not build mini-bases after this point if they destroy them.
> 2535428931727626;19:
> > 2533274859484857;17:
> > > 2535428931727626;15:
> > > This is starting to piss me off. Same thing different day. AIR IS WEAK TO AA. hard to Imagine right? believe it. I have the same math from a post from yesterday about the costs so i’ll type it down again. Reavers cost 175s/225e to total 4200s/5400e for 120. A wolf costs 150s/190e to cost a total of 4500s/5700e. A Hornet costs 325s/0e to costs a total of 9750s/0e and it’s Banished counterpart, the Banshee, costs 300s/0e to cost a total of 12000s/0e. If you add the cheapest AA and cheapest air resources, it cost 150 less resources. Heres the catch. YOU DON’T NEED 120 POP OF ANTI-AIR TO BEAT MASS AIR. A simple investment of 8 Reavers and 8-10 Wolverines or 40 pop will suffice with core infantry or Marauder or Warhog mix.
> > >
> > > Here is a few downsides too massing air:
> > > You must build more supply pads than generators.
> > > They are T2 and thus hard to produce early with their also high costs
> > > Harder time controlling powernodes
> > > With less power, they also generate Leader Points slower
> > > Easy to be killed by cheap core Infantry which is also faster to build and can be massed far earlier than air.
> > > Harder to transition from air to something with power with high supply pad requirements
> > >
> > > There are also few but fewer advantages:
> > >
> > > Manueverability
> > > very quick
> > > Counters some vehicles
> > >
> > > Overall, air is garbage and its upsides are outweighed by it’s downsides. Too even get the simple idea air is OP is far from the truth so if you see someone is building lots of air, this takes time and resources and if you are agressive, you will never have air as a issue.
> >
> > There mobility is a huge advantage though that makes up their weakness . hit and run tactics
>
> Mobility is still not a issue with scouting but i’ll not build mini-bases after this point if they destroy them.
I was just saying that air has very string advantages even if few
