Join in Progress, itself, is a paradox. It is there to ensure that no players suffer from cowardly teammates quitting, but it also tends to be a burden on matchmaking as well. Often times, people are suddenly cast into a game that is a guaranteed defeat, which then leads to an inevitable drop in their CSR.
By this point, many have asked for the outright removal of JiP; however, JiP is one of the few things that ensure that 4v1 Teabagging sessions never happen to players that stay behind as their teammates quit.
With that being said, JiP can be a beneficial feature if improved…
SOLUTION
To ensure that honest players are never forced to carry the burden of those that quit their matches by being cast into a losing game, a karma system will herald the act of Join in Progress:
Every time a player quits a match, the next match they play will be a Join-in-Progress that sends them into a losing game. Also, their chances of getting a future JiP will grow exponentially with each quit.
This would not only ensure that honest players aren’t scapegoated, but it would also discourage quitting altogether.
> Sounds good, <mark>but how would it go about differentiating people with connection issues from actual quitters?</mark>
>
> My buddy RavensHal0 had some good ideas on fixing JIP. I’m sure he’ll be here soon.
Good point. Perhaps it would be possible to detect whether or not it was a player-initiated quit (leaving the game, signing out, exiting to dashboard) or an accidental one. If your Xbox lost power (though that could be abused), or if your connection timed out, you shouldn’t be punished for that.
> Sounds good, but how would it go about differentiating people with connection issues from actual quitters?
>
> My buddy RavensHal0 had some good ideas on fixing JIP. I’m sure he’ll be here soon.
Or we could have a little ticky box that says Join in Progress enabled/disabled so that people could actually have the choice to start every single Matchmaking game fresh if they want to, which they should most definitely have.
And if you say “THEN EVERYONE WOULD TURN IT OFF” as another did when I proposed this simple fix the first time, that kind of speaks for itself about the feelings of the Halo community.
> Or we could have a little ticky box that says Join in Progress enabled/disabled so that people could actually have the choice to start every single Matchmaking game fresh if they want to, which they should most definitely have.
>
> And if you say “THEN EVERYONE WOULD TURN IT OFF” as another did when I proposed this simple fix the first time, that kind of speaks for itself about the feelings of the Halo community.
Yes, nobody likes to join a game in progress. But nobody likes fighting a team of 4 by themselves either. So no, making it an option wouldn’t fix that problem.
> > Sounds good, <mark>but how would it go about differentiating people with connection issues from actual quitters?</mark>
> >
> > My buddy RavensHal0 had some good ideas on fixing JIP. I’m sure he’ll be here soon.
>
> Good point. Perhaps it would be possible to detect whether or not it was a player-initiated quit (leaving the game, signing out, exiting to dashboard) or an accidental one. If your Xbox lost power (though that could be abused), or if your connection timed out, you shouldn’t be punished for that.
Honestly, that’s a rare enough event that it won’t affect the vast majority of people if they aren’t abusing it, if this exact system is implemented with decent numbers on how fast the exponential effect occurs.
Not bad, I like where you’re going with it. It would be very difficult to implement for real time matchmaking, but with enough coding and effort I could see it working. Remember that people will always find ways to abuse a system no matter how fool-proof it is.
If CSR is implemented (and it should be), de-rankers will consistently quit out on purpose knowing full well they’ll get a loss and be put in another losing game. No amount of ban-hammering will fix this.
I say, give players the option to turn off JIP in the matchmaking menu, like a search preference similar to same language, good connection, etc… That way, people can chose whether or not they want to a join a game thats fresh or in-progress, instead of betting on their chances.
> > Or we could have a little ticky box that says Join in Progress enabled/disabled so that people could actually have the choice to start every single Matchmaking game fresh if they want to, which they should most definitely have.
> >
> > And if you say “THEN EVERYONE WOULD TURN IT OFF” as another did when I proposed this simple fix the first time, that kind of speaks for itself about the feelings of the Halo community.
>
> Yes, nobody likes to join a game in progress. But nobody likes fighting a team of 4 by themselves either. So no, making it an option wouldn’t fix that problem.
Some of the problems with enable/disable JIP could be solved by separating ranked/social playlists and adjusting the options accordingly. If ranked playlists DID NOT have JIP it would likely encourage more people to stay and finish as long as there was a penalty for quitting. If CSR is in place it would be impossible to make JIP work since we would run into the same problem we have now of players joining losing games. And personally if I had to chose I’d MUCH rather have CSR.
My idea was that everyone can JIP but before it happens there will be a screen that says “Would you like to JIP?” with the game’s stats below (remaining time, each team’s score and the team you’re bound to join). This creates a five second timer during which you can decline the match by pressing B, if the match’s score is too grim. This would apply to matches that have taken place over 60 seconds, the rest would be an instant join (at least in non-ranked playlists).
This could also go well with your suggested system- quitters would just not have the option to decline matches.
I say Karma system and have the game monitor if players quit or force themselves out of the game such as joining a friend or going to dashboard. The XB will know if someone intentionally shuts it off, so if it is read that it is shut off in the middle of a game. First time is a pass…an anomaly. Second time is a coincidence maybe they still have and issue and it just hasn’t been resolved yet third time. We are being played. Let it go with 8 hour measurements.
I hope that seems reasonable. Let it monitor their patterns and than let it judge. Quitters need to be punished, they are abandoning their allies and probably dooming an entire team to failure with them leaving.
I’m sure we have we have all been in that one game when one guy quits and you start losing than other people quit and than the rest have to decide is it worth fighting and losing for no goal, having multiple deaths with little reward. With JIP its like losing troops in a battle with the possibility of reinforcements coming in.
I love JIP for that reason, i have turned that tide of many games from JIP even more games than i have joined in and lose, but i’m sure more people don’t get the moment of turning the tide just about every time so i can understand their rage with trying to join a fair game and the enemies have a Wraith, two banshees Incarceration cannon and your base on lock down.
> Or we could have a little ticky box that says Join in Progress enabled/disabled so that people could actually have the choice to start every single Matchmaking game fresh if they want to, which they should most definitely have.
>
> And if you say “THEN EVERYONE WOULD TURN IT OFF” as another did when I proposed this simple fix the first time, that kind of speaks for itself about the feelings of the Halo community.
Like what others had said, it’s more irritating to be stuck in a 4 v 1 than it is to be forced into a losing game. At least with joining a losing game, you get to know that you’ve helped a fellow Halo player battle against the other team after their teammates had abandoned them.
There shouldn’t be an option to turn JiP off, as it is a perfect way to punish quitters.
> Join in Progress, itself, is a paradox. It is there to ensure that no players suffer from cowardly teammates quitting, but it also tends to be a burden on matchmaking as well. Often times, people are suddenly cast into a game that is a guaranteed defeat, which then leads to an inevitable drop in their CSR.
>
> By this point, many have asked for the outright removal of JiP; however, JiP is one of the few things that ensure that 4v1 Teabagging sessions never happen to players that stay behind as their teammates quit.
>
> With that being said, JiP can be a beneficial feature if improved…
>
> SOLUTION
>
> To ensure that honest players are never forced to carry the burden of those that quit their matches by being cast into a losing game, a karma system will herald the act of Join in Progress:
>
>
>
>
> Every time a player quits a match, the next match they play will be a Join-in-Progress that sends them into a losing game. Also, their chances of getting a future JiP will grow exponentially with each quit.
>
> This would not only ensure that honest players aren’t scapegoated, but it would also discourage quitting altogether.
>
you are always going to get into game where your team is loosing why? because who quits a winning team, the only reason a team is down less players is because they are getting stomped so they quit.
of course there are connection issues or betrayals where someone will be booted from the winning team but for the most part you are always going to join the loosing team with JIP just scrap it and have a karma system for people who quit where you cannot start to matchmake until the previous game is done and you are more likely to get into games with people that quit/betray
> > Join in Progress, itself, is a paradox. It is there to ensure that no players suffer from cowardly teammates quitting, but it also tends to be a burden on matchmaking as well. Often times, people are suddenly cast into a game that is a guaranteed defeat, which then leads to an inevitable drop in their CSR.
> >
> > By this point, many have asked for the outright removal of JiP; however, JiP is one of the few things that ensure that 4v1 Teabagging sessions never happen to players that stay behind as their teammates quit.
> >
> > With that being said, JiP can be a beneficial feature if improved…
> >
> > SOLUTION
> >
> > To ensure that honest players are never forced to carry the burden of those that quit their matches by being cast into a losing game, a karma system will herald the act of Join in Progress:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Every time a player quits a match, the next match they play will be a Join-in-Progress that sends them into a losing game. Also, their chances of getting a future JiP will grow exponentially with each quit.
> >
> > This would not only ensure that honest players aren’t scapegoated, but it would also discourage quitting altogether.
> >
>
> you are always going to get into game where your team is loosing why? because who quits a winning team, the only reason a team is down less players is because they are getting stomped so they quit.
Okay, how does punishing quitters with JiP affect you in a negative way? If you don’t quit, then you won’t have to worry about it at all.
> of course there are connection issues or betrayals where someone will be booted from the winning team but for the most part you are always going to join the loosing team with JIP just scrap it and have a karma system for people who quit where you cannot start to matchmake until the previous game is done and you are more likely to get into games with people that quit/betray
You see, I’d gladly advocate the removal of Join-in-Progress.
But I can’t.
Game after game in Halo 3 and Halo Reach I’ve been forced to watch the ENTIRE enemy team -Yoink!- me every time they killed me after my “honorable” teammates quit. Join-in-Progress was a blessing in my mind, I didn’t have to worry about constantly being ripped off by my teammates. However, I also was forced into losing matches with Halo 4’s JiP, which made my likeness for it plummet. That’s why I proposed that it should be used as a punishment for quitters.
Now ask yourself… Would you rather remove a feature that ensures that honest players aren’t forced to watch their opponents humiliate them after their teammates quit when you could just use it as a means to punish quitters?
If you’re so concerned about JiP putting you in a losing game, my solution to it would ensure that that never happens to you (assuming that you aren’t a quitter).