An idea to help "balance" AL - Armor Lock Discussion

Games Other Halo
1

Now, we all know that AL is overpowered at the moment. For those that don’t, I shall compare the positives and flaws between it and another armour ability.

Armour Lock Positives:

Invincible
Can destroy oncoming vehicles
EMP can neutralise nearby vehicles
Stun effect if opponent melees
AOE EMP which gets rid of shields
Can instantly flip around in any direction the user wants when exiting
Plasma Grenade shredding :frowning:
Rockets and any kind of projectile can bounce off it
Recharges quickly and can be used in bursts
Lasts long enough for your shields to recharge
Can look around anywhere while activated
‘Frosting’ effect to stop being instantly killed afterwards

Armour Lock Negatives:

You can’t move while it’s activated
You have to be on the ground to activate it

Now. Compare that to something like Active Camo.

Active Camo Positives:

You’re invisible
Jams the enemies radar if nearby

Active Camo Negatives:

You have to move very slowly for it to actually work
Jams your radar (Sometimes your own teams too - Due to a glitch)
Muffles your sound

Can you see something there? Armour Lock is too strong. It has too many positives and not enough flaws. Now, some say that the easiest thing would be to remove it altogether, but I think that would be a bad decision. Too many people use it.

What I’m suggesting as a change is as follows:

Instead of becoming Thor for 7 seconds, I suggest it makes the user almost invincible for 4 seconds (A max time. The damage resistance would be exponential. After 1 second, DR would = 130%. After 2 seconds 180%. After 3 seconds it would climax at 250% Damage Resistance. This means that it will still be possible to damage the user while it’s activated.

A longer recharge time between uses.

No more Plasma Grenade Shredding.

No more looking around while activated.

No more frosting effect.

I think that changes like the above will make AL something that most people can play against without feeling like they’ve been cheated. It would make AL fit in a particular role, and it would require somewhat skill to use, unlike now.

Just a suggestion. I like that there are playlists without AL, but I don’t want to be confined to those all the time.

2

It’s a decent idea, but I’d reverse the damage resistances; have the highest resistance at the start of the lock, with it dropping off over time as it “overheats” or otherwise burns energy.

3

> A longer recharge time between uses.
>
> No more Plasma Grenade Shredding.
>
> No more looking around while activated.
>
> No more frosting effect.
>
>
>
> I think that changes like the above will make AL something that most people can play against without feeling like they’ve been cheated. It would make AL fit in a particular role, and it would require somewhat skill to use, unlike now.

Amen. Please 343i do something about it, or don’t make the same mistakes as Bungie.

Actually, forget about AL and any Armor Ability when you make your own Halo, all they did was ruin Reach.

4

> Now, we all know that AL is overpowered at the moment. For those that don’t, I shall compare the positives and flaws between it and another armour ability.
>
> Armour Lock Positives:
>
> Invincible
> Can destroy oncoming vehicles
> EMP can neutralise nearby vehicles
> Stun effect if opponent melees
> AOE EMP which gets rid of shields
> Can instantly flip around in any direction the user wants when exiting
> Plasma Grenade shredding :frowning:
> Rockets and any kind of projectile can bounce off it
> Recharges quickly and can be used in bursts
> Lasts long enough for your shields to recharge
> Can look around anywhere while activated
> ‘Frosting’ effect to stop being instantly killed afterwards
>
> Armour Lock Negatives:
>
> You can’t move while it’s activated
> You have to be on the ground to activate it
>
>
> Now. Compare that to something like Active Camo.
>
> Active Camo Positives:
>
> You’re invisible
> Jams the enemies radar if nearby
>
> Active Camo Negatives:
>
> You have to move very slowly for it to actually work
> Jams your radar (Sometimes your own teams too - Due to a glitch)
> Muffles your sound
>
>
> Can you see something there? Armour Lock is too strong. It has too many positives and not enough flaws. Now, some say that the easiest thing would be to remove it altogether, but I think that would be a bad decision. Too many people use it.
>
> What I’m suggesting as a change is as follows:
>
> Instead of becoming Thor for 7 seconds, I suggest it makes the user almost invincible for 4 seconds (A max time. The damage resistance would be exponential. After 1 second, DR would = 130%. After 2 seconds 180%. After 3 seconds it would climax at 250% Damage Resistance. This means that it will still be possible to damage the user while it’s activated.
>
> A longer recharge time between uses.
>
> No more Plasma Grenade Shredding.
>
> No more looking around while activated.
>
> No more frosting effect.
>
>
>
> I think that changes like the above will make AL something that most people can play against without feeling like they’ve been cheated. It would make AL fit in a particular role, and it would require somewhat skill to use, unlike now.
>
>
> Just a suggestion. I like that there are playlists without AL, but I don’t want to be confined to those all the time.

i agree with this.

armor lock does everything it needs to do to be good in ONE SECOND duration. more than MAYBE 2.5 seconds is just overpowered. 6+ seconds makes armor lock the most blatantly overpowered thing to ever reach the final product of a halo game.

its obvious why bungie implemented this, however. a lot of the people who dont like reach are the ‘tough guise’ who think halo is for ‘-Yoink-’ or whatever. giving these ‘tough guise’ the ability to armor lock to gain invincibility for 6+ seconds makes them feel how they hope to feel in a daily basis in real life.

its only natural for people to defend it, but at the end of the day, its still BLATANTLY OVERPOWERED not even being remotely close to being balanced. with a single press of a button, you gain a +~80% survival rate regardless of how much damage youve taken beforehand, provided you … kinda… stick next to your team, and have teammates who are even a little bit competent.

arguing that armor lock isnt blatantly overpowered is about as effective as arguing that the earth is bigger than the sun.

5

If you really want to balance it out, instead of making the resistance increase/decrease over the duration, make it constant but bearable and more logical.

My example would be make normal weapons like AR and DMR seem like its having no effect, while ordnance weapons do a reasonable amount of damage (like 25-40% of your shields instead of near-OHKO or the like with no AL).

In addition, instead of outright destroying some vehicles on impact, treat the AL user as a bit of a ramp and cause vehicles like Ghosts and Revenants to be pushed to the side or overhead while still causing some damage.

Duration reduction would be very useful, and 3-5 seconds is reasonable in my view. Keep the recharge the same or extend it if the duration of the effect is kept.

The EMP effect is nice, but make it effect a smaller area than it already does (nothing like thinking you are out of range of the pulse and they let go and pummel/headshot you while your shields went down from said pulse suddenly expanding and clipping you.)

The only other AA that I find needs improvement is Hologram, but that is a discussion for another topic I suppose.

6

I think simply removing the EMP effect against other players, the ability to shed stickies, and a minimum of two seconds use would make AL much less annoying to come up against. I don’t mind it being used as an anti-vehicle ability, that is fine. What I find most annoying is when I come up to pummel or shotgun an enemy, he armor-locks for a spit-second which EMPs my shields, then he pummels me while his frost makes him invulnerable.

I mostly play custom games now because I can’t stand how people in MM use AL.

7

I disagree that AL is imbalanced but at the same time I think changes can be made. The best suggestion I have is to remove or lesson the “negatives” of 1 or 2 other AAs.

For Active-Camo, instead of red-dots interfering with the radar, I’d like the enemies screen to indicate through static-noise the closeness. Either their radar or HUD itself will flicker and show EM-anomalies that increase in frequency of annoyance as the invisible player gets closer. You know, just a flicker of white noise/ screen aliasing glitching?
I’d keep the sound muffling to block out the sound of a sprinter or evader but I’d give the movement speed some lenience. Firing a shot should reveal the user but I’d like it if a player could walk-stop in very short pulses and maintain full cloak. Also if the melee didn’t reveal the player unless striking something like a player or wall. I’d like .5- .8 seconds of free-movement before the effects lessens. Crouch-walking would still be the best way to move completely invisible but given the ability to make small movements while standing would be nice.

Ok 1 AA, the rest are fine. I just find Active too restricting in movement for what its worth.

I don’t use Hologram but its ability to take block melees and non-powerweapon hits makes it great for defense. I think that’s a great benefit for a slight-of-hand ability.

I think all AAs have that “something great” about them BUT Active. Even though I hate standing still, I can understand how invincibility is a great trade-off.

8

Nope. Just remove it from Multi-player. Its fine in firefight(maybe) and campaign but in Multi-player it’s too overpowered. Remember invincibility in Halo 3? It was taken out of multi-player because it was too OP.

Armor Lock has destroyed sticking, vehicles, and etc. I don’t want this abomination anymore.

9

I don’t have a problem with AL at all.

The OP is being a little dramatic, and comparing Apples to Oranges here. I mean, it’s a little like saying that the Rocket Launcher is OP because it’s not a pistol, and they both are one handed weapons. They’re two different things and you can’t do that.

I would not favor a change to the AL mechanic at all, but I have no problem with it being excluded from certain playlists.

Really, the whiners should just get over it, but it doesn’t effect me at all to have it in or not.

10

> I don’t have a problem with AL at all.
>
> The OP is being a little dramatic, and comparing Apples to Oranges here. I mean, it’s a little like saying that the Rocket Launcher is OP because it’s not a pistol, and they both are one handed weapons. They’re two different things and you can’t do that.
>
> I would not favor a change to the AL mechanic at all, but I have no problem with it being excluded from certain playlists.
>
> Really, the whiners should just get over it, but it doesn’t effect me at all to have it in or not.

I played CE, H2, and H3. I say Armor Lock should just go from matchmaking. I will be fine if its only in Campaign and Firefight.

And also Bungie is removing Armor and Dropshield from Objective because it slows down the gameplay and objective in the playlist. I think Armor Lock is starting to be weeded out of Multi-player. Bungie should add 110% speed and jump to BTB to remove Armor Lock from there also.

11

Everyone not using armour lock will obviously find something negative to say about it. Sure it can be annoying if a whole team is using it (which is seldom the case), but it would be just as annoying if a whole team was using invisibility.

But armour lock is not perfect, it is well known to suddenly FAIL for no apparent reason and just snap you out of it even tho you’ve been in lock for a second or two already. And also not everyone can use it well. There is that element of uncertainty, “who gets out of armour lock first” and is able “to armour lock” more efficiently. It takes a bit of skill as well, it’s not all mindless.

If we’re going to talk about over-powerness we should just as well talk about the sniper rifle. Sure, noo one wants to get rid of that! But think about it, it’s an all-powerful weapon where you can just hide away somewhere and kill someone at a distance with one single shot, and potentially without anyone being able to reach you or see you. Call me crazy, but that is much more annoying and cowardly than armour lock will ever be imho (in case you didn’t already guess, I hardly ever use the sniper rifle, and therefore I found something negative so say about it).

12

I just realised I sounded really annoyed. I’m not! lol :slight_smile:

13

> > I don’t have a problem with AL at all.
> >
> > The OP is being a little dramatic, and comparing Apples to Oranges here. I mean, it’s a little like saying that the Rocket Launcher is OP because it’s not a pistol, and they both are one handed weapons. They’re two different things and you can’t do that.
> >
> > I would not favor a change to the AL mechanic at all, but I have no problem with it being excluded from certain playlists.
> >
> > Really, the whiners should just get over it, but it doesn’t effect me at all to have it in or not.
>
> I played CE, H2, and H3. I say Armor Lock should just go from matchmaking. I will be fine if its only in Campaign and Firefight.
>
> And also Bungie is removing Armor and Dropshield from Objective because it slows down the gameplay and objective in the playlist. I think Armor Lock is starting to be weeded out of Multi-player. Bungie should add 110% speed and jump to BTB to remove Armor Lock from there also.

Seriously?

/inserts Halo Resume’ longer than YOURS here.

WELL I SAY IT BELONGS, SOOOOOO… =P

AL is fine, I wouldn’t change the mechanic because it works the same in Multi-player as it does in Campaign or Fire Fight.

So my first recommendation stands, People should just adapt to it.

But I’m fine with certain things being removed from multi-player, as they likely weren’t designed for multi-player.

I have to lol though, as frustrating as it is to come across four drop shields over a single Objective, That is kind of the point of drop shield, isn’t it?

With your BTB idea though… and I don’t mean to derail this thread anymore than you already have… But it seems like you desire to have inconsistancies between the Single-player and Multi-player encounters with regards to physics.

It’s my understanding that the last Medal of Honor attempted this and it didn’t work out so well.

I respect where you’re going with modifying multi-player… But my concern remains the same as it does with the MLG/Classic playlists… If you create different “feels” in every playlist it will sew confusion and disorder where most players don’t care, they just want a consistent product.

14

> I disagree that AL is imbalanced

you have GOT to be trolling. you just have to be.

> The OP is being a little dramatic, and comparing Apples to Oranges here.

how is comparing 2 armor abilities not a logical approach to assessing if they are imbalanced or not? its not apples to oranges, its granny smith apples to red apples.

> So my first recommendation stands, People should just adapt to it.

ok so… how, exactly, does one ‘adapt’ to the following situation:

-4 players on the other team use armor lock in the team slayer gametype on sword base
-4 players on the other team stick together

the fact of the matter is, armor lock is nothing short of BLATANTLY OVERPOWERED, not close. its not even remotely balanced at higher levels of play. sure, at lower levels of play its not a problem because people are somehow too slow to press that single button before the grenade blows up and they get headshotted, but at even above average play no one is that slow at pressing their AA button. if you stick next to your team, use armor lock, and have teammates who arent straight up horrible, armor lock is literally a +80% survival rate button to get you out of ANY situation that isnt a sniper bullet to the face (on the vast majority of maps).

its literally not even remotely close to being debatable.

15

You’re right about one thing iQ, it’s not debatable at all!

You’re just wrong. Horribly, Horribly wrong.

At ALL levels of play the mechanic works the same for everyone. That allows for multiple strategies at any level, even the higher ones.

More AA options, leaves more counters and more strategies open for use.

LIMITING AA’s, such as removing AL LIMITS the strats any player at any level has.

You ask about 2 equally skilled groups of 4 with one group sporting AL… AS IF The other group was going to be denied that loadout… C’mon man.

Make ONE valid argument in ONE thread ANYWHERE on this forum, PLEASE.

But you’re right about that one thing… it isn’t even debatable.

AL isn’t balanced, it is what it is, and just because you can’t beat it, doesn’t mean it’s broken at “High levels of Play”.

16

> You’re right about one thing iQ, it’s not debatable at all!
>
> You’re just wrong. Horribly, Horribly wrong.
>
> At ALL levels of play the mechanic works the same for everyone. That allows for multiple strategies at any level, even the higher ones.
>
> More AA options, leaves more counters and more strategies open for use.
>
> LIMITING AA’s, such as removing AL LIMITS the strats any player at any level has.
>
> You ask about 2 equally skilled groups of 4 with one group sporting AL… AS IF The other group was going to be denied that loadout… C’mon man.
>
> Make ONE valid argument in ONE thread ANYWHERE on this forum, PLEASE.
>
> But you’re right about that one thing… it isn’t even debatable.
>
> AL isn’t balanced, it is what it is, and just because you can’t beat it, doesn’t mean it’s broken at “High levels of Play”.

Living Dead is what it is. Does that make it balanced? Hell no! Pinnacle is what it is. Is it balanced? No.

Limiting AL doesn’t remove strategies, it opens strategies for people who would have otherwise just stuck to AL. One of my friends uses AL exclusively, and we have to save him when he gets into a jam. Without it, his skills really show. AL limits people because they don’t have to worry about making a mistake. They don’t have to learn. They can just press the do-over button (AL). Without it, they have to learn how to use their gun, and fight for themselves, rather than having their friends bailing them out all of the time. They have to learn from their mistakes.

Also, name me a Halo game that gave you complete invincibility in MM. One

17

> You’re right about one thing iQ, it’s not debatable at all!
>
> You’re just wrong. Horribly, Horribly wrong.
>
> At ALL levels of play the mechanic works the same for everyone. That allows for multiple strategies at any level, even the higher ones.
>
> More AA options, leaves more counters and more strategies open for use.
>
> LIMITING AA’s, such as removing AL LIMITS the strats any player at any level has.
>
> You ask about 2 equally skilled groups of 4 with one group sporting AL… AS IF The other group was going to be denied that loadout… C’mon man.
>
> Make ONE valid argument in ONE thread ANYWHERE on this forum, PLEASE.
>
> But you’re right about that one thing… it isn’t even debatable.
>
> AL isn’t balanced, it is what it is, and just because you can’t beat it, doesn’t mean it’s broken at “High levels of Play”.

It seems to me your argument is basically “AL isn’t unbalanced because everyone can use it” … Sure, and if everyone starts with Rockets, they are balanced as well. But if the choice is Loadout 1 with Rocket Launcher and everything else is plasma pistol, then where’s the balance?

My entire team shouldn’t be forced to use AL just to counter AL. In comparison to the other armor abilities, Armor Lock is OP. In the right hands it’s basically a third weapon, an instant EMP.

As far as I’ve seen most of the defenders of AL are people that just love using it aggressively this way. They don’t want to see their cheap trick weakened in any way.

18

> Living Dead is what it is. Does that make it balanced? Hell no! Pinnacle is what it is. Is it balanced? No.

Apples to Oranges again.

> Limiting AL doesn’t remove strategies, it opens strategies for people who would have otherwise just stuck to AL. One of my friends uses AL exclusively, and we have to save him when he gets into a jam. Without it, his skills really show. AL limits people because they don’t have to worry about making a mistake. They don’t have to learn. They can just press the do-over button (AL). Without it, they have to learn how to use their gun, and fight for themselves, rather than having their friends bailing them out all of the time. They have to learn from their mistakes.

I just don’t get this, your complaints are that AL is overpower and a team of good players can exploit it, then your example is of someone who you admit sucks and constantly needs to be saved from it.

You say taking AL away will make people better. It’s a video game, why do you need me to get better? Why can’t I just have fun playing the way I want to play?

> Also, name me a Halo game that gave you complete invincibility in MM. One

This isn’t fair to AL at all. When you make the statement “Complete invincibility in MM” you’re implying that this person can run around, get way, kill anything in their path. That’s simply not the case and you know it.

If someone doesn’t come in to save your buddy, he’s dead.

You are the same guys who complain about how ‘unfair’ bloom is on 1vs1 DMR battles, yet when someone rocks AL suddenly 1v1 battles Never happen in Halo.

I’m not trying to argue with you guys, I’m just pointing out how terribly inconsistent your belief system is, and why the majority of players don’t agree with you.

19

> > Living Dead is what it is. Does that make it balanced? Hell no! Pinnacle is what it is. Is it balanced? No.
>
> Apples to Oranges again.
>
>
>
> > Limiting AL doesn’t remove strategies, it opens strategies for people who would have otherwise just stuck to AL. One of my friends uses AL exclusively, and we have to save him when he gets into a jam. Without it, his skills really show. AL limits people because they don’t have to worry about making a mistake. They don’t have to learn. They can just press the do-over button (AL). Without it, they have to learn how to use their gun, and fight for themselves, rather than having their friends bailing them out all of the time. They have to learn from their mistakes.
>
> I just don’t get this, your complaints are that AL is overpower and a team of good players can exploit it, then your example is of someone who you admit sucks and constantly needs to be saved from it.
>
> You say taking AL away will make people better. It’s a video game, why do you need me to get better? Why can’t I just have fun playing the way I want to play?
>
>
>
> > Also, name me a Halo game that gave you complete invincibility in MM. One
>
> This isn’t fair to AL at all. When you make the statement “Complete invincibility in MM” you’re implying that this person can run around, get way, kill anything in their path. That’s simply not the case and you know it.
>
> If someone doesn’t come in to save your buddy, he’s dead.
>
> You are the same guys who complain about how ‘unfair’ bloom is on 1vs1 DMR battles, yet when someone rocks AL suddenly 1v1 battles Never happen in Halo.
>
> I’m not trying to argue with you guys, I’m just pointing out how terribly inconsistent your belief system is, and why the majority of players don’t agree with you.

You annoy me with how you say you are the majority. Where are you getting your facts? It’s about balance. AL isn’t balanced. That EMP that takes out my shields and stuns me just because you decided to activate AL at the last second because you know you’ve lost is balanced in favor of the better player? I suppose using AL to blow up ghosts is balanced too? Or having the ability to shed plasmas? What other Armor Ability gives you so many perks? None.

Also, you have yet to reveal where you pull these random “facts” that you are the majority. Where are you getting this info? You are acting like whatever you say goes, because you are the “majority”. Show me the facts, then we’ll see. Also, I agree with the guy above. You don’t want AL weakened in anyway, because then your cheap trick won’t be as effective as it used to be.

And I am ambivalent about bloom. Again, show me the facts that you are in the “majority”.

20

> It seems to me your argument is basically “AL isn’t unbalanced because everyone can use it” … Sure, and if everyone starts with Rockets, they are balanced as well. But if the choice is Loadout 1 with Rocket Launcher and everything else is plasma pistol, then where’s the balance?

Don’t imply that AL has the killing power of a RL, that’s just irresponsible.

> My entire team shouldn’t be forced to use AL just to counter AL. In comparison to the other armor abilities, Armor Lock is OP. In the right hands it’s basically a third weapon, an instant EMP.

Your entire team is doomed to failure if you’re picking an AA based on what the other team is using. AA’s are more situational than that at EVERY level of play.

> As far as I’ve seen most of the defenders of AL are people that just love using it aggressively this way. They don’t want to see their cheap trick weakened in any way.

I’ve seen some cheap/great AL players. Most just take longer to kill, but I don’t mind, a kill is a kill, teams of ALers make for teams of easy kills where I can try new/fun things on.

Myself? Well I’ll defend AL because it’s obvious that AL haters will lie/imply things that aren’t true just because it frustrates them.

But when it comes to my AA’s I decide what to use based on the map and my goal, and that’s worked out for me so far.

I mean, would you really go with AL on Caged or Uncaged? The point being, know your level, your team, and your abilities, and use them, don’t worry about using AL in case you get that magical match up against godly AL teams, cause it doesn’t happen.

And anyone saying it happens, is fear mongering, cause it doesn’t happen nearly enough to ever worry about such a bad strategy.