I have a funny suggestion on how Join In Progress (JIP) should work in a fair way in the future.
What if every time somebody quit a game in matchmaking, or backed out in the pre-game lobby, they increase the chance of being chosen to join in progress?
Here’s how it would work: For every match you quit, you receive a “JIP token”. Every “JIP token” would give you priority over those that have less JIP tokens or none at all, when being selected for joining a game in progress. You would be able to get rid of these pesky JIP tokens by completing JIP games, or by completing 2 or 3 games from start to finish.
That way, frequent quitters will be chosen to join gaps in teams left by their own kind more frequently than those who do not quit, and did not cause the problem.
JIP should still obviously only occur at the start of matches like it is now, but that’s not what this thread is about.
> It’s a nice idea, but sadly it won’t work for 2 reasons
>
> 1)You can easily avoid JIP games, bu changing network settings before you’re fully JIP’ed in
>
> 2)Either the quitter will still quit out, or just stop playing the game altogether…
>
> But as I said its a nice idea in theory anyway, but JIP is better if used before the game actually starts and from then on is disabled
Those are valid arguments, however, I think it would still be better to have it than not have it.
quitters will consistently be bothered by JIP games, even if they don’t join them, because they can’t get rid of their JIP tokens. To warrant this, I think it would be safer if 343i did not told us they actually added a system where quitters are preferred for JIP matchups. And if a frequent quitter stops playing the game, what’s not to like?
So, unless there is something i’m overlooking here, I think 343i should give this a shot. What is there to lose?
The problem with JIP is that it replaces players who are quitting a game only because they are losing. This means the new players are being thrown into a losing game 90% of the time. If you’re like me, you’d rather not spend the rest of the game working to fix what the people you replaced screwed up so I quit out myself and switch playlists for a game to ensure it doesn’t try putting me in the game again.
JIP should be disabled after about 3 minutes into a game. That way it’s still early enough in the game that way the scores are lower and people aren’t stuck trying to dig themselves out of an avalanche with a spoon.
> The problem with JIP is that it replaces players who are quitting a game only because they are losing. This means the new players are being thrown into a losing game 90% of the time. If you’re like me, you’d rather not spend the rest of the game working to fix what the people you replaced screwed up so I quit out myself and switch playlists for a game to ensure it doesn’t try putting me in the game again.
>
> JIP should be disabled after about 3 minutes into a game. That way it’s still early enough in the game that way the scores are lower and people aren’t stuck trying to dig themselves out of an avalanche with a spoon.
it already does prevent join in progress after a certain milestone. JIP has taught me for this game to not care about my W/L ratio, because in any game, 9 times out of 10. The reason I lose is because of just awful teammates. Sure sometimes I don’t do as well as I could possibly do, but when you go 20-3 in swat and still lose because someone went 2-26, trust me it isn’t just JIP at that point…
I would have lot’s if these tokens since I quit everytime I’m JIPed into Pro. Then I will be more JIPed into Pro (since Pro matches are these which mostly have empty places from people who quit to not play them) and this spiral of madness will go deeper and deeper.
How about removing Slayer Pro from Infinity playlists and making Forge maps third-choice only, so there will be much less people who would quit or go back to lobby?
> I would have lot’s if these tokens since I quit everytime I’m JIPed into Pro. Then I will be more JIPed into Pro (since Pro matches are these which mostly have empty places from people who quit to not play them) and this spiral of madness will go deeper and deeper.
>
> How about removing Slayer Pro from Infinity playlists and making Forge maps third-choice only, so there will be much less people who would quit or go back to lobby?
The entire purpose of the tokens would be to DISCOURAGE quitting, regardless of the state of matchmaking. Bad gametypes or maps or gametype/map combinations have always existed, (though, admittedly, less so in previous games) yet people quit now more than ever because quitting is, in a way, encouraged.
If you finish JIP games, you will lose your JIP tokens faster, to reward you more for sitting out a poor game. This will also make people that joined in progress stay instead of just leave again. Once you are rid of all JIP tokens, you will be bothered less by JIP than you are now, because it will be the quitters that suffer, not you.
All of this happens when JIP has been optimized the way it has been in throwdown: Only in the very first minute are people allowed to JIP.
Asking the rest of matchmaking to be optimized to your liking to reduce the frequency of quitting is like trying to fix correct matchmaking by increasing the population by improving the game. You are right in a way that that would be a fix, but it’s the ideal fix that 343i hasn’t been able to achieve yet. If 343i would know a perfect playlist constitution and a perfect game that everyone would love, they would have already implemented it, preferrably from the day of release. But that obviously didn’t work out, so we need to tackle all small things that would be fixed by a larger population directly, with many small improvements to tackle every small problem such as quitting.
That is also why I’m suggesting this, mainly for Halo 5: it is another factor that contributes to having a perfect game FROM DAY 1. I can’t stress enough how important this is for the future of Halo 5: A nearly perfect game from day 1 will result in a larger population, which in turn improves the quality of matchmaking which in turn will allow more people to keep coming. It’s a positive spiral.
People quit when they have to quit, like when lags make match unplayable. In this case punishing them is useless. Another case is rage quit. Punishing won’t prevent it because it’s, well, RAGE quit.
IMO instead of punishing for quiting there should be some reward that will encourage people to finishing the match. This would also do as recompense for those who are JIPed into match. In other fps it’s XP bonus for finishing the match, but since most people are 130lvl, then it seems to be useless. 343i should come out with something else then or give us another 1000 levels.
I mentioned Pro and Forge because when they showed up, quiting and getting back to lobby is much more frequent. When all 3 options are Pro, then BUM! - people are getting back to lobby. Then match begins and people are JIPed into it. Since games are made to give fun, I see no reason for this.
Honestly, I think we should bring back penalties for quitting. And no, not that 10 minute quit-ban -Yoink-. That was just useless.
You quit enough to become registered in the system for a few matches as a habitual quitter. Penalty: After a warning is displayed, telling you that you have been added to the “quitter list” over the next few games, you are on probation. If you quit during the probational period you lose either an entire level, or a significant amount of XP.
If we ever see a specific set of ranked playlists, it impacts your skill rating. Some one cannot be good if they aren’t dedicated. So no stats to show for it.
I say screw JIP, bring back the penalties for quitting and add bots to replace the people that quit.
Bots? Yes, bots! You’re not going to lose a game where your entire team has quit out on you if all of your teammates are replaced by Spartans controlled by the Halo: Reach Elite’s AI. To prevent the other team from getting seriously pwnd by the new AI, we can make it so the AI Spartans will stop to -Yoink!- enemy players or shoot their corpses repeatedly after killing them.
> I say screw JIP, bring back the penalties for quitting and add bots to replace the people that quit.
>
> Bots? Yes, bots! You’re not going to lose a game where your entire team has quit out on you if all of your teammates are replaced by Spartans controlled by the Halo: Reach Elite’s AI. To prevent the other team from getting seriously pwnd by the new AI, we can make it so the AI Spartans will stop to -Yoink!- enemy players or shoot their corpses repeatedly after killing them.
>
> Thank me later.
So you want to scare people away from the game by making it chore and also bring bots on their place? Wow. Just wow.
> > The problem with JIP is that it replaces players who are quitting a game only because they are losing. This means the new players are being thrown into a losing game 90% of the time. If you’re like me, you’d rather not spend the rest of the game working to fix what the people you replaced screwed up so I quit out myself and switch playlists for a game to ensure it doesn’t try putting me in the game again.
> >
> > JIP should be disabled after about 3 minutes into a game. That way it’s still early enough in the game that way the scores are lower and people aren’t stuck trying to dig themselves out of an avalanche with a spoon.
>
> it already does prevent join in progress after a certain milestone. JIP has taught me for this game to not care about my W/L ratio, because in any game, 9 times out of 10. The reason I lose is because of just awful teammates. Sure sometimes I don’t do as well as I could possibly do, but when you go 20-3 in swat and still lose because someone went 2-26, trust me it isn’t just JIP at that point…
What is this milestone you speak of then? Because I’ve still been joining games 10 kills from the end, or Dominion where the enemy team has 390 out of 400 points.
> > >
> >
> > it already does prevent join in progress after a certain milestone. JIP has taught me for this game to not care about my W/L ratio, because in any game, 9 times out of 10. The reason I lose is because of just awful teammates. Sure sometimes I don’t do as well as I could possibly do, but when you go 20-3 in swat and still lose because someone went 2-26, trust me it isn’t just JIP at that point…
>
> What is this milestone you speak of then? Because I’ve still been joining games 10 kills from the end, or Dominion where the enemy team has 390 out of 400 points.
>
> Pretty sure you’re wrong.
He is right, such milestones already exist, except they are tailored to the playlist. Team Throwdown has a very strict milestone where you can only JIP before the game starts or in the first half minute. Dominion is a more casual playlist with larger parties and thus the JIP is not as strict there.
As I stated in the OP, all playlists should have the strict Team Throwdown JIP milestones. But this thread isn’t about that, it’s about finding creative ways of punishing quitters, tackling the source of the problem.
> > > >
> > >
> > > it already does prevent join in progress after a certain milestone. JIP has taught me for this game to not care about my W/L ratio, because in any game, 9 times out of 10. The reason I lose is because of just awful teammates. Sure sometimes I don’t do as well as I could possibly do, but when you go 20-3 in swat and still lose because someone went 2-26, trust me it isn’t just JIP at that point…
> >
> > What is this milestone you speak of then? Because I’ve still been joining games 10 kills from the end, or Dominion where the enemy team has 390 out of 400 points.
> >
> > Pretty sure you’re wrong.
>
> He is right, such milestones already exist, except they are tailored to the playlist. Team Throwdown has a very strict milestone where you can only JIP before the game starts or in the first half minute. Dominion is a more casual playlist with larger parties and thus the JIP is not as strict there.
>
> As I stated in the OP, all playlists should have the strict Team Throwdown JIP milestones. But this thread isn’t about that, it’s about finding creative ways of punishing quitters, tackling the source of the problem.
I didn’t realize that. I don’t play Throwdown much because you need a team to be competitive and I know very few people at my skill level so I never realized it had a different JIP setup.
But I disagree with punishing quitters. You either punish quitters and remove JIP or you keep JIP and leave quitters alone. Quitting is an option provided in the game menu.
I for one use it liberally myself mostly because of JIPing games that are hopeless losses. I’m not going to sit around while 343 wastes my time throwing me in unwinnable games because my only other option is quitting and being punished. I don’t play games to follow 101 rules on how the developer wants to dictate what choices I’m allowed to make.
I say keep JIp, but add a search preference for it AND…
PUNISH THE QUITTERS!
We’re talking temporary bans for quitting over five times a day. It is extremely annoying for EVERYONE when some ten year-old quits after the first 3 minutes because I took his Rocket Launcher away from him.
> > I say screw JIP, bring back the penalties for quitting and add bots to replace the people that quit.
> >
> > Bots? Yes, bots! You’re not going to lose a game where your entire team has quit out on you if all of your teammates are replaced by Spartans controlled by the Halo: Reach Elite’s AI. To prevent the other team from getting seriously pwnd by the new AI, we can make it so the AI Spartans will stop to -Yoink!- enemy players or shoot their corpses repeatedly after killing them.
> >
> > Thank me later.
>
> So you want to scare people away from the game by making it chore and also bring bots on their place? Wow. Just wow.
Huh? If you’re talking about penalties for quitting, that doesn’t make the game a chore or scare people away. I rarely ever quit out of a game in Halo 3 because of the penalties for quitting and I didn’t want to “embrace my cowardice and prematurely leave the battlefield”. All it does is encourage people not to abandon their teammates in the middle of a game, and if you don’t care about the punishments you probably don’t care about the game much too, so that doesn’t effect you.
Also, you just proved that you’ve either never played the Campaign or you can’t take a joke. Pro tip: The things I said about bots were a joke.
> Also, you just proved that you’ve either never played the Campaign or you can’t take a joke. Pro tip: The things I said about bots were a joke.
Sorry I didn’t got you joke. Other developers are actually doing it (like Epic with GoW3…), so we shouldn’t laugh upon something that is probable…
As for penalties and chores, I’m serious. First, it’s important to eliminate reasons why people quit (Pro, Forge maps, lags). Second, to give them reason to actually finish the match they’re stuck with.
With bad gametypes and technical issues (ever tried to play whole match on Forge map when playing splitscreen?) more penalties is what will scare more people away from the game.
How about they just went back to good old Ranked and Social playlists. Social would have the usual social stuff such as JiP and Ranked would obviously not have JiP.
> How about they just went back to good old Ranked and Social playlists. Social would have the usual social stuff such as JiP and Ranked would obviously not have JiP.
They’ve already tried that with Team Throwdown. This playlist didn’t had JIP at first, but 343i had to add it bacause people suddenly realized that notorious 4v2 or 3v1 matches aren’t as great as they remember from Halo 3.
> > How about they just went back to good old Ranked and Social playlists. Social would have the usual social stuff such as JiP and Ranked would obviously not have JiP.
>
> They’ve already tried that with Team Throwdown. This playlist didn’t had JIP at first, but 343i had to add it bacause people suddenly realized that notorious 4v2 or 3v1 matches aren’t as great as they remember from Halo 3.
That’s not really ranked, just a bad form of a competitive playlist slapped with social type of elements on it. You basically don’t get punished for quitting in Throwdown, sure game has a 1 h ban but that’s after a good amount of quits.
A pure ranked playlists punish people for quitting, either they lose big time on their Skill Level or they are banned from the game.
Basically when people know they are playing a pure ranked playlist they are less likely to quit(sure some may still quit), simply because they decided to play ranked and their mind is set to play ranked when they decided to search.
Counter Strike Global Offensive ban players for 1 week if they regularly quit a competitive match. This again all comes back to ranked/competitive and social playlists, players are still free to quit when ever they want to in the Social playlists in CS:GO.