Alright, what did I miss/do wrong?!?

I’ve read a few tutorials and how-tos about respawning, but I obviously misunderstood or completely missed something. Re-reading didn’t solve my problem, so I’m asking you for help.

I’m currently creating a map with four bases (red, blue, green, orange) and want it to support FFA, red vs. blue, and all four teams in slayer and objective games. The problem I’m having is with respawning.

So far I’ve placed one initial spawn point per team in the middle of each team’s base, surrounded by seven respawn points each so it can theoretically support BTB (although the map is too small). Approximately 30 additional respawn points are distributed evenly around the map; all respawn points are set to neutral.

I’ve placed a large, neutral respawn area that covers the whole map (a “normal” one, not anti or weak), and four more normal respawn areas that cover each of the bases, set to the respective team; here’s red team’s respawn area.

While testing the map in 1-on-1 split-screen Team Slayer I noticed that I keep respawning in seemingly random locations and not at respawn points in my team’s respawn area. Furthermore, I respawn right above or below my opponent surprisingly often.

I haven’t set up objective games yet, so I can’t test if respawning is different in such games. Honestly, I doubt it.

So, what did I do wrong? It must be something, but I have absolutely no idea what it is.

Are you sure, for your team spawn zones, you changed the Team and not the Color? That’s the only potential cause I can think of.

> Are you sure, for your team spawn zones, you changed the Team and not the Color? That’s the only potential cause I can think of.

Yes, I’ve checked that. I definitely set team and not just color.

You set up respawns to all neutral, get rid of the large neutral spawn zone and creat different spawn zones for each base, also if youre making the spawn zones for multiple game types, load up that game type in forge and set the spawn zone to game specific: true

> You set up initial spawns to all neutral,

Screenshots show that the Initials are team-owned as they are supposed to be. Normal points are neutral so that FFA doesn’t break.

> get rid of the large neutral spawn zone

That’s not the problem. If he removes that zone, then any spawns that are supposed to remain neutral in team games will instead go unused in team games.

> and creat different spawn zones for each base

OP already did.

I’ve now also set up objective games. Well, only CTF for now. And while testing the spawns in 1-on-1 split-screen CTF (one red and blue player each), the spawns are still messed up. At one point I moved both players to the unused green base and killed the blue player and he respawned smack in the middle of red base, literally two steps away from the flag.

That should not happen, ever. >:(

I’ve re-checked for the fourth time if the initial spawn points and the team-specific respawn areas are all set to their respecitive teams. They are. And I still have no idea why it’s not working as it should.

According to various guides, tutorials, etc. on B.net and Forgehub, I did everything as I’m supposed to.

Basic Answer:
Try switching the team-specific spawn zones to Weak zones. Two Normal or “Strong” respawn zones do not add together just as two Weak zones do not add together.

Complicated Answer
Here’s some numbers to explain the reasoning. Say that a Strong Respawn Zone has a weight of +200 and a Weak Zone has a weight of +100 while Anti Zones have -100. In your map, all Respawn points have a weight of 200 to start with, as you have placed a respawn zone over the entire map. As the two Strong zones do not add together, the smaller ones are negated, therefore you spawn at random places because all respawn points have the same weight. However, a Weak Zone and a Strong Zone DO add up, so therefore the spawns at each base will have a weight of 300 while spawn points that are not inside a team-specific Weak Respawn Zone only have 200. This means that players are more likely to spawn at their base. However, an enemy nearby has a weight of -100, so now if you are on blue team while a red is in blue base, you are just as likely to spawn somewhere else as you are to spawn in your base. Therefore, you will probably spawn somewhere else on the map.

Other Recommendations:
If you want it to be a rarity that you ever spawn on your opponent’s side, try using Anti-Respawn Zones as well.

That’s basically all I have for you. It definitely looks like a good map. The only thing I can say I dislike about it is it has all those teleporters. But I also don’t know how those teleporters work or if there is any other means to get between levels, so if that’s your best choice, by all means stick with them. If you’ve read through this whole post, then thank you for listening to me.

> --post–

Alright, thanks. I’ll try that.

> > --post–
>
> Alright, thanks. I’ll try that.

It won’t work the way you intend it, but it does give me an idea.

Removing the smaller zones will mean that the points inside don’t act team-assigned in team games. However, one of the earlier suggestions could be correct given a proud nerd’s reasoning (I shouldn’t have shot it down so quickly).

Remove the Neutral Strong Zone and keep the team-owned ones. But if you have any points that are supposed to remain neutral in team games and that are not inside of the smaller Strong Zones, give them their own Neutral Strong Zones or they will not be used by the spawning algorithm!

If the problem is caused by a Neutral Strong canceling out an overlapping Team Strong – and I’ve never heard of that happening, but it could be the case – then altering the Zones so that Neutral Strongs only cover points that Team Strongs don’t cover, should fix it while ensuring that the neutral points don’t go unused.

> > > --post–
> >
> > Alright, thanks. I’ll try that.
>
> It won’t work the way you intend it, but it does give me an idea.
>
> Removing the smaller zones will mean that the points inside don’t act team-assigned in team games. However, one of the earlier suggestions could be correct given a proud nerd’s reasoning (I shouldn’t have shot it down so quickly).
>
> Remove the Neutral Strong Zone and keep the team-owned ones. But if you have any points that are supposed to remain neutral in team games and that are not inside of the smaller Strong Zones, give them their own Neutral Strong Zones or they will not be used by the spawning algorithm!
>
> If the problem is caused by a Neutral Strong canceling out an overlapping Team Strong – and I’ve never heard of that happening, but it could be the case – then altering the Zones so that Neutral Strongs only cover points that Team Strongs don’t cover, should fix it while ensuring that the neutral points don’t go unused.

Wouldn’t that make it so that every point has the same weight? What I mean is, because they’re all owned by the same type of Zone, the algorithm assigns them all the same weight, so wouldn’t that mean you’ve changed nothing? Plus it makes it so that in Team games players will almost never spawn outside of their area while in FFA games players will never spawn inside of a Team area.

I’ve replaced the team-specific strong spawn areas with weak spawn areas (also team-specific) and now it works most of the time. I still had blue player respawn in the red base two steps away from the flag once, though, so I’m thinking about adding anti respawn zones.

Just a (probably stupid) question about anti respawn zones: When I set an anti respawn zone to blue team, for example, does that mean that blue team members are more unlikely to spawn there, or that anyone else is more unlikely to spawn there?

> Wouldn’t that make it so that every point has the same weight? What I mean is, because they’re all owned by the same type of Zone, the algorithm assigns them all the same weight, so wouldn’t that mean you’ve changed nothing?

A Respawn Zone owned by X only adds weight for players on Team X. Ergo for any given player, the points in their base and the points not in anyone’s base will be usable, but the points in enemy bases will not be usable.

> Plus it makes it so that in Team games players will almost never spawn outside of their area

Which is generally the intended effect. Neutral spawns outside of all bases can help prevent this from becoming a problem.

> while in FFA games players will never spawn inside of a Team area.

Ah, true, I hadn’t considered that.

Really, the setup of one Neutral Zone containing several Team Zones should work. I’ve seen it work. This thread is the one and only time I have ever heard of it not working… So I’m stumped. I do wonder if FFA_ONLY on the all-encompassing Neutral could work…

> I’ve replaced the team-specific strong spawn areas with weak spawn areas (also team-specific) and now it works most of the time. I still had blue player respawn in the red base two steps away from the flag once, though, so I’m thinking about adding anti respawn zones.

You can try that, but the problem is that Weaks and Antis can be overridden by the factors that the spawning engine considers during gameplay – line of sight, teammate death locations, etc… Their effects on spawn weighting aren’t nearly as pronounced as Strong Zones.

> Just a (probably stupid) question about anti respawn zones: When I set an anti respawn zone to blue team, for example, does that mean that blue team members are more unlikely to spawn there, or that anyone else is more unlikely to spawn there?

An X-owned Zone only affects spawn weighting for players on X Team, so a Blue Anti Zone decreases the likelihood that anyone on Blue Team will use the spawn points contained in it.