Aim Down the Sights In Halo 5

Games Halo 5: Guardians
99

> > <mark>If someone absolutely needs ADS to enjoy a shooter, it’s fine by me for them to play games that are not Halo. I don’t need them</mark>, but I would sincerely recommend them to expand their perspective.
>
> How big do you really believe the HARDCORE arena community is? 100,000? 200,000?
> I don’t even think its 30,000 or 40,000. Their are millions of gamers out there that like shooters and the Destiny Beta proved that. The Halo community needs to grow to be successful. Halo needs to grow or the next trilogy will be a DLC from the Xbox Arcade, because games for 30k players are not AAA.

And what makes you believe those millions of people will flock to Halo because of a purely aesthetic ADS gimmick and not continue playing Call of Duty, Battlefield and Titanfall?

100

No thanks. It makes no sense in the Halo universe and would destroy Halo’s classic gameplay worse than anything introduced in the last few years.

101

> How big do you really believe the HARDCORE arena community is? 100,000? 200,000?
> I don’t even think its 30,000 or 40,000

I don’t know but I feel its an irrelevant point. One doesn’t need to be a hardcore arena fan to see why this change is controversial.

[+]A company has a chocolate bar. They see that many people also like peanuts. The company believes that these two things would taste well together. So they make a new chocolate bar that contains peanuts. While not everyone likes it, it’s a huge success with many chocolate fans, with people who like peanuts, and with people who just happened to stumble upon the bar.

[-]Another company makes frozen Pizzas. They see that Hot Wings are a popular trend. They decide to mix in Hot Wings with their current toppings. However, because of the specific toppings they have, the tastes don’t blend well. They end up with a product that some people like while many others find it repulsive. Eventually, due to lack of support, this line of Pizza is just canned entirely.

Moral:
It’s okay to take ideas, copy ideas, and mix ideas. People need to stop being so naive about it. Almost everything, even Halo CE, is derivative. But it has to be done intelligently.

If you just throw in ADS, without any thought put into how it would work with the game itself, you end up with a product no one wants simply because all the mechanics of that product are at odds, and lead to an experience that simply doesn’t play well. The game doesn’t need ADS to win over people, it needs ADS implemented in a proper manner. And many would say ADS inherently can’t be implemented properly without changing many other portions of the game, which would lead to a different experience entirely.

I would argue it can’t work. ADS slows down your strafe, and extremely limits how far you can jump horizontally. Meaning you can’t move and fight at the same time, it’s one or the other. This runs contrary to how the game is designed to play. Furthermore, you and your enemy would have an easy time hitting each other, and killtimes would be long. So it would result in just seeing someone first, then shooting them for a few seconds until they die while taking heavy damage in the process. Does this sound like a game people would want to play?

102

> > <mark>If someone absolutely needs ADS to enjoy a shooter, it’s fine by me for them to play games that are not Halo. I don’t need them</mark>, but I would sincerely recommend them to expand their perspective.
>
> How big do you really believe the HARDCORE arena community is? 100,000? 200,000?
> I don’t even think its 30,000 or 40,000. Their are millions of gamers out there that like shooters and the Destiny Beta proved that. The Halo community needs to grow to be successful. Halo needs to grow or the next trilogy will be a DLC from the Xbox Arcade, because games for 30k players are not AAA.

Halo 3 consistently had 200-400k online at all times for several years. It had a peak population after a year of 1.1 million. Halo 2 led populations on xbox the entire time time it was online. There are way more Hardcore gamers than you actually believe. This question will be answered with the release of MCC because you will see massive populations on Halo 2.

103

Hypothetical argument for the sake of argument: what if halo had an ADS that DOES NOT slow you down? you trade FOV for accuracy. FOV narrows slightly when you ADS due to a very slight zoom effect, and the edges of the screen become a bit soft and out of focus.

ADS fans get their mechanic, halo is not slowed down for those that don’t want it, and with the exception of the BR and other precisions you wont really even need to use it anyway because the accuracy of guns like the AR wont magically improve.

Descope could be changed to a flinch so that sniper/DMR can sill be countered.

Thoughts?

104

> Hypothetical argument for the sake of argument: what if halo had an ADS that DOES NOT slow you down? you trade FOV for accuracy. FOV narrows slightly when you ADS due to a very slight zoom effect, and the edges of the screen become a bit soft and out of focus.
>
> ADS fans get their mechanic, halo is not slowed down for those that don’t want it, and with the exception of the BR and other precisions you wont really even need to use it anyway because the accuracy of guns like the AR wont magically improve.
>
> Descope could be changed to a flinch so that sniper/DMR can sill be countered.
>
> Thoughts?

No way. One thing I love about Halo is how you aim.

105

No.

106

> > > <mark>If someone absolutely needs ADS to enjoy a shooter, it’s fine by me for them to play games that are not Halo. I don’t need them</mark>, but I would sincerely recommend them to expand their perspective.
> >
> > How big do you really believe the HARDCORE arena community is? 100,000? 200,000?
> > I don’t even think its 30,000 or 40,000. Their are millions of gamers out there that like shooters and the Destiny Beta proved that. The Halo community needs to grow to be successful. Halo needs to grow or the next trilogy will be a DLC from the Xbox Arcade, because games for 30k players are not AAA.
>
> Halo 3 consistently had 200-400k online at all times for several years. It had a peak population after a year of 1.1 million. Halo 2 led populations on xbox the entire time time it was online. There are way more Hardcore gamers than you actually believe. This question will be answered with the release of MCC because you will see massive populations on Halo 2.

I hope so… I have my doubt’s though. You have to get people to buy the game first. Then those have to be players that still want to experience something old.

107

It’s completely unnecessary.

The reason we don’t have a physical “aim down sight” mechanic from a fictional standpoint, is because if you bother to look at the model for a Spartan, he is always in a stable aiming position no matter how he moves.

Also I’m not sure if you’ve ever aimed down the sight of a weapon with a helmet on. It’s IMPOSSIBLE to properly line up your eyes with the sights, that’s why soldiers don’t wear helmets that cover their faces, only ones that protect the tops of their heads, so they can get their eyes lined up with their sights. So from a realism standpoint, it doesn’t make sense.

Spartans in their Mjolnir armor are capable of aiming with exact precision while moving with blistering agility, and their Smartlink allows their HUD to easily track the exact location their gun is pointing, and utilize a weapon’s scope without holding it to the eye. So from a gameplay mechanic, there is literally no reason to add it either, all it would accomplish is that all the weapons in the game would have to be SIGNIFICANTLY less accurate by default, and when you get into a fight, you would have to completely sacrifice your ability to MOVE/DODGE just to be capable of hitting a target.

108

LOL I thought this was a joke post at first.

ADS would be the worst idea ever for Halo.

Non-ADS is what makes Halo gameplay…Halo gameplay.

No way man.

109

> Hypothetical argument for the sake of argument: what if halo had an ADS that DOES NOT slow you down?

What exactly would be the point? I suppose it might make aiming more difficult, though canonically it wouldn’t make sense and I’m not sure making aiming more difficult in that fashion would be beneficial for the game.

110

Halo already has aim down sights for precision weapons, except done better. Many ADS systems unrealistically restrict your vision as a balancing measure.

Perhaps halo could give all (or most) weapons some sort of advanced aiming feature. Precision and other scoped weapons would act as they currently do, while automatics could be given the option to aim for slightly increased range/precision while sacrificing movement.

Some weapons, like the needler don’t make a lot of sense when aimed, but its not impossible.

111

> Halo 3 consistently had 200-400k online at all times for several years. It had a peak population after a year of 1.1 million.

No, it didn’t. By the end of 2008, it was peaking at ~200,000, and since February of 2008 there is no proof that even the 24 hour population count would ever have risen above 1,000,000. Not that it makes any difference, Halo 3 still had impressive numbers, but not as impressive as you would think. Many people tend to exaggerate them.

You can see for yourself: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1zBm1AvqXnLSj9UFt23-Uy9-wM5A0B3hhC8kGf0fouAw

Note that the player counts are not peaks, but whatever amount was online at the time the snapshot of the bungie.net front page was taken. But you can extrapolate the peaks from them.

112

ADS only works in games with fast TTK, Halo is not one of those games.

113

> > > Canonically & <mark>morally</mark> it is totally wrong.
> >
> > Eh?
>
> Moral people wouldn’t torture Halo with ADS.

I mean morally wrong, as in it’s totally against Halo’s ethos.

ADS would ruin Halo’s multiplayer.

Reasons:

The speed of ADS would make MP unbalanced.

Imagine how easy it would be to get those sniper headshots,
if you only had to hold LT to zoom in?

Can’t have ADS without sprint

You would need to have sprint if ADS was in halo,
without it, it would be so difficult to outgun someone
who spots you first, as you simply couldn’t get away/dodge.
It would be similar to COD, where it’s basically who fires first, wins.
And sprint is another thing which is taboo among the Halo community.

It would break canon

In the lore, the weapons directly integrate with
the Spartans Mjolnir Armor, which is why you can see
the amount of bullets you have, the amount in the clip, in the HUD.

the HUD provides a reticle for the weapon,
so for a Spartan have to use ADS would break canon, and make so sense at all.

114

> Hypothetical argument for the sake of argument: what if halo had an ADS that DOES NOT slow you down? you trade FOV for accuracy. FOV narrows slightly when you ADS due to a very slight zoom effect, and the edges of the screen become a bit soft and out of focus.
>
> ADS fans get their mechanic, halo is not slowed down for those that don’t want it, and with the exception of the BR and other precisions you wont really even need to use it anyway because the accuracy of guns like the AR wont magically improve.
>
> Descope could be changed to a flinch so that sniper/DMR can sill be countered.
>
> Thoughts?

Don’t like hip fire spread, don’t like Flinch.

115

> Hypothetical argument for the sake of argument: what if halo had an ADS that DOES NOT slow you down? you trade FOV for accuracy. FOV narrows slightly when you ADS due to a very slight zoom effect, and the edges of the screen become a bit soft and out of focus.
>
> ADS fans get their mechanic, halo is not slowed down for those that don’t want it, and with the exception of the BR and other precisions you wont really even need to use it anyway because the accuracy of guns like the AR wont magically improve.
>
> Descope could be changed to a flinch so that sniper/DMR can sill be countered.
>
> Thoughts?

So are weapons inaccurate when not aiming down the sight? If so it’s a forced mechanic, would it not be?

Here’s another question though. Why try to shoehorn in a mechanic to please an audience that supposidly only cares about the mechanic in question? And in turn potentially change the gameplay for the worse for those who are not a fan of said mechanic?

I don’t see a need to cram in feature after feature in order to win over some audience from another series. Which is mostly what some of the debates now adays boils down to, instead of wether or not the game itself benefits from the mechanic or not.

116

>

I’m well aware of the reasons. I just like how over-the-top some comments are . . . and I enjoy pointing that out.

117

> > > > Canonically & <mark>morally</mark> it is totally wrong.
> > >
> > > Eh?
> >
> > Moral people wouldn’t torture Halo with ADS.
>
> I mean morally wrong, as in it’s totally against Halo’s ethos.
>
> ADS would ruin Halo’s multiplayer.
>
> Reasons:
>
> The speed of ADS would make MP unbalanced.
>
> Imagine how easy it would be to get those sniper headshots,
> if you only had to hold LT to zoom in?

you assume ADS would be fast for sniper. You also assume the it would function differently than it currently does for a sniper.

> Can’t have ADS without sprint
>
> You would need to have sprint if ADS was in halo,
> without it, it would be so difficult to outgun someone
> who spots you first, as you simply couldn’t get away/dodge.
> It would be similar to COD, where it’s basically who fires first, wins.
> And sprint is another thing which is taboo among the Halo community.

this is not necessarily true.

> It would break canon
>
> In the lore, the weapons directly integrate with
> the Spartans Mjolnir Armor, which is why you can see
> the amount of bullets you have, the amount in the clip, in the HUD.
>
> the HUD provides a reticle for the weapon,
> so for a Spartan have to use ADS would break canon, and make so sense at all.

the same could be said for not having sprint… Or any number of things that appear in the lore but are not accurately portrayed in the game.

It has some bearing, but the final resulting gameplay is most important.

(Edited to fix quotes)

118

> Stuff

All of those are strawmen.

This is why we do not want ADS in Halo.