A replacement for friendly fire?

-Problem: Friendly Fire is abused.
-Problem: Friendly Fire is necessary to prevent unnecessary grenade spam, more thoughtful playing.

-Solution: Friendly Fire Ricochet.

If I hit a teammate with a BR burst, the BR burst damage is applied to me, and my teammate is unaffected. This is not a reflection of bullets, but an algorithm. It is instant.

Now:
Positives:
-Betrayals cannot occur, friendly fire cannot be abused.
-Encourages even more thoughtful game play, since people generally care more about themselves than their teammates. They won’t needlessly throw grenades and hope their team mates survive, like I have seen in a lot of matches.
-You cannot be booted.

Negatives:
-Team mates purposely being in your way. That occurs with normal betraying, too. We can partially fix this by reducing the ricochet damage to a lower normal, preventing instant kills.

Whatever the case, it is a lot better than what we have now, more team communication is required.

Do you like this model? What improvements could be made? Is it better than the old system?

> -Problem: Friendly Fire is abused.
> -Problem: Friendly Fire is necessary to prevent unnecessary grenade spam, more thoughtful playing.
>
> -Solution: Friendly Fire Ricochet.
>
> If I hit a teammate with a BR burst, the BR burst damage is applied to me, and my teammate is unaffected. This is not a reflection of bullets, but an algorithm. It is instant.
>
> Now:
> Positives:
> -Betrayals cannot occur, friendly fire cannot be abused.
> -Encourages even more thoughtful game play, since people generally care more about themselves than their teammates. They won’t needlessly throw grenades and hope their team mates survive, like I have seen in a lot of matches.
> -You cannot be booted.
>
> Negatives:
> -Team mates purposely being in your way. That occurs with normal betraying, too.
>
> Do you like this model? What improvements could be made? Is it better than the old system?

Keep it like it is, improve the betrayal system, one betrayal is fine, no option to kick, second & onwards betrayal, option to kick.

“I’m throwing a grenade!”
teammate runs in, gets hit by the blast and laughs at your suicide

> “I’m throwing a grenade!”
> teammate runs in, gets hit by the blast and laughs at your suicide

You should have been more careful with your grenade.

No, no, and no. Remove friendly fire. People spam grenades anyway. I die all the time due to people throwing grenades carelessly. I boot whenever I get the chance just to tell those people to stop being -Yoinks!-.

> No, no, and no. Remove friendly fire. People spam grenades anyway. I die all the time due to people throwing grenades carelessly. I boot whenever I get the chance just to tell those people to stop being -Yoinks!-.

I find that illogical. I’ll give you an analogy.

-Get rid of arson laws, people burn stuff illegally anyway.

No friendly fire is a ridiculous grenade spam fest, have you ever played Halo PC?

> > “I’m throwing a grenade!”
> > teammate runs in, gets hit by the blast and laughs at your suicide
>
> You should have been more careful with your grenade.

How can you be careful with teammates running into your grenades so that you’ll get hurt by it damaging them?

> > > “I’m throwing a grenade!”
> > > teammate runs in, gets hit by the blast and laughs at your suicide
> >
> > You should have been more careful with your grenade.
>
> How can you be careful with teammates running into your grenades so that you’ll get hurt by it damaging them?

Communication. That is what I am trying to encourage, more team work.

Also, that happens in the current system, except it ends up with the reverse death and the possibility of you getting booted.

> > No, no, and no. Remove friendly fire. People spam grenades anyway. I die all the time due to people throwing grenades carelessly. I boot whenever I get the chance just to tell those people to stop being -Yoinks!-.
>
> I find that illogical. I’ll give you an analogy.
>
> -Get rid of arson laws, people burn stuff illegally anyway.
>
> No friendly fire is a ridiculous grenade spam fest, have you ever played Halo PC?

People already complain enough about grenade spam. There have been numerous threads saying “nerf the grenukes”. If you want to stop the grenade spam you need to do something with the grenades. Taking friendly fire out isn’t going to change a thing. Also, in BTB careless drivers run me over all the time.

People aren’t smart enough to deal with friendly fire. It is a pointless mechanic that causes nothing but rage.

> > -Problem: Friendly Fire is abused.
> > -Problem: Friendly Fire is necessary to prevent unnecessary grenade spam, more thoughtful playing.
> >
> > -Solution: Friendly Fire Ricochet.
> >
> > If I hit a teammate with a BR burst, the BR burst damage is applied to me, and my teammate is unaffected. This is not a reflection of bullets, but an algorithm. It is instant.
> >
> > Now:
> > Positives:
> > -Betrayals cannot occur, friendly fire cannot be abused.
> > -Encourages even more thoughtful game play, since people generally care more about themselves than their teammates. They won’t needlessly throw grenades and hope their team mates survive, like I have seen in a lot of matches.
> > -You cannot be booted.
> >
> > Negatives:
> > -Team mates purposely being in your way. That occurs with normal betraying, too.
> >
> > Do you like this model? What improvements could be made? Is it better than the old system?
>
> Keep it like it is, improve the betrayal system, one betrayal is fine, no option to kick, second & onwards betrayal, option to kick.

I would agree with you but I just got betrayed twice in the last game I played because my teammate wanted the power weapon I had (Which this happens WAY to often). It didn’t even give me the option to boot him until the second. I’m okay with accidental betrayels but if some -Yoink- betrays me on purpose I shouldn’t have to put up with that. I’d perfer if you could not damage a teammate at all. I agree the reflection thing the OP said is kinda a bad idea. Because if I throw a grenade and my dummy teammate runs into it after I had thrown it and it has landed then I die! That’d be pretty stupid. And I have to wait to respawn and score reduction.

Well what about truly accidental betrayals by lets say a wraith tank and it wasnt the wraiths fault (warthog decides to defy odds and catch bomb trying to splatter target). The driver might even understand and choose not to boot. Ive always felt tank drivers need some leeway when it comes to instant betrayals, something like this would make the wraith blow up instantly hurting the team more than the warthog dying. We just need a better betrayal system and more punishment for being booted rather than making it equal to a quit.

Not necessarily, the vehicles don’t blow up in my model.

then the driver dies and enemy team steals it, even worse. I like the betrayal system just needs improvement in my opinion. your idea isnt bad though, been successfully implemented in other games i believe

The only way a system like this could work is if it was limited to (at maximum) dropping your shields. Adding the ability to kill yourself by shooting/blowing up your teammate would actually encourage trolling, not discourage it.

Imagine this scenario: You’re playing TS with 2 buddies and 1 random who doesn’t have a mic. You and your buddies all know to nade a certain hallway with pretty much everything you’ve got, but idiot random walks into said hallway. That’s 3 deaths because of one idiot who’s likely to get blown up by the other team in .5 seconds anyways.

I’ve played a variety of games that used FF ricochet and I can tell you, the majority of the time it’s just all bad. Just think of how many times you’ve been caught on the edge of your buddy’s grenade blast radius and it’s taken a chunk out of your shields but not popped them. If, for some reason, his shields are down and his health isn’t full he’s just died for no reason and the team is weaker for it.

> The only way a system like this could work is if it was limited to (at maximum) dropping your shields. Adding the ability to kill yourself by shooting/blowing up your teammate would actually encourage trolling, not discourage it.
>
> Imagine this scenario: You’re playing TS with 2 buddies and 1 random who doesn’t have a mic. You and your buddies all know to nade a certain hallway with pretty much everything you’ve got, but idiot random walks into said hallway. That’s 3 deaths because of one idiot who’s likely to get blown up by the other team in .5 seconds anyways.
>
> I’ve played a variety of games that used FF ricochet and I can tell you, the majority of the time it’s just all bad. Just think of how many times you’ve been caught on the edge of your buddy’s grenade blast radius and it’s taken a chunk out of your shields but not popped them. If, for some reason, his shields are down and his health isn’t full he’s just died for no reason and the team is weaker for it.

That is a good idea.

It’s a good idea and it works for cod but in Halo when you have to duel for 4 or 5 shot kills it would drive people crazy getting out br/dmr’d due to team mates running into the cross fire which happens often imo.

> -Problem: Friendly Fire is abused.
> -Problem: Friendly Fire is necessary to prevent unnecessary grenade spam, more thoughtful playing.
>
> -Solution: Friendly Fire Ricochet.
>
> If I hit a teammate with a BR burst, the BR burst damage is applied to me, and my teammate is unaffected. This is not a reflection of bullets, but an algorithm. It is instant.
>
> Now:
> Positives:
> -Betrayals cannot occur, friendly fire cannot be abused.
> -Encourages even more thoughtful game play, since people generally care more about themselves than their teammates. They won’t needlessly throw grenades and hope their team mates survive, like I have seen in a lot of matches.
> -You cannot be booted.
>
> Negatives:
> -Team mates purposely being in your way. That occurs with normal betraying, too. We can partially fix this by reducing the ricochet damage to a lower normal, preventing instant kills.
>
> Whatever the case, it is a lot better than what we have now, more team communication is required.
>
> Do you like this model? What improvements could be made? Is it better than the old system?

This is the second best option in my opinion. The first, is to only have FF on in playlists like mlg gametypes, and turn it off for everything else. At least to try it for like a month and see how it plays out. But yes, if that isn’t suitable, ricochet FF is my ideal solution. There’s too much grief with friendly fire on, all just to try and encourage players to play a little more cautiously with their teammates, which most don’t anyways. The cons far outweigh the pros in my opinion.
For example, with FF on:
-teammates betray each other for weapons and vehicles
-you lose teammates when they get booted for betrayals
-teammates can constantly strip your shields but let enemies kill you so they don’t get punished

is all that really worth putting up with just so players hopefully play more carefully around teammates? Why not just for a month try FF off? Or even just make 1 duplicate team slayer playlist, except with FF off to test against the one with FF on, to see which is better for gameplay. I don’t see how it can’t be better for gameplay to allow players to be more careless with their weapons if it stops significantly more grief. Yes there would be some annoying aspects to it, like if a player just grenades his teammates ghost while he’s getting hijacked to save him. Or if tanks/rockets etc. griefed their teammates in other vehicles by just tossing them around etc. (which could be tweaked so with no FF then players explosions don’t effect teammates)

That being said, I know it’s not gonna happen. From a realistic point of view, FF on is the only one that makes sense, which I think is going to be the deciding factor. I don’t know, maybe FF off isn’t the solution. But I think they could at some point make a duplicate playlist or two with FF off to compare and see how it works. And the same for Ricochet FF.

> “I’m throwing a grenade!”
> teammate runs in, gets hit by the blast and laughs at your suicide

this exactly. some people are stupid and deserve the betrayal they get

The problem is people will still use it to aggravate players on their team.

How about this:

When you shoot an enemy you do damage to them just like the past system, except you cannot kill them, you can only strip their shields.
But after you do enough damage to strip their shields 2x it switches to ricochet fire.

I think this is the best solution to betrayal-booting.