(A) plea to keep Cycling Grenades off the D-Pad

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

Here is a video which details all the control schemes in the Halo 5: Guardian’s multiplayer Beta:

Apart from [LB] and [LT] being incorrectly swapped on these diagrams, these layouts appear to be correct.

In the Default, Southpaw, Green Thumb and Recon control schemes (A) is Jump / Clamber.

Things are no better with the Bumper Jumper control scheme where [LB] is Jump / Clamber - as (A) is Sprint, rather than Cycle Grenades / Reload Secondary Weapon.

Indeed, this Bumper Jumper control scheme forces you to take your left thumb off (LS) to Cycle Grenades with the D-Pad, which means that you can’t Cycle Grenades whilst you are running from one location to another! Anyone wanting the familiar Bumper Jumper layout popular in Halo 3 will not find it here, due to the wierd decision by 343i to make it so that (A) is Sprint, when it could quite easily have made (X) be Sprint forwards and then allow you to Dodge left and right by Strafing with (LS).

This could also be combined with a tap of [LB] to Jump into the air, or a hold of [LB] to Hover in mid-air using the Stabilizer, you could choose to Glide around with (LS) as with any ordinary ‘floaty jump’, or Dodge around in any given direction by combining (LS) with (X). There would be no need for a separate Thruster Pack button as (X) would do the job with [LB] being held to get you airborne and keep you there until you released it.

By keeping (A) for Cycling Grenades / Reload Secondary Weapon, (B) for Reload Primary Weapon / Action, (X) for Sprint / Dodge, and (Y) for Switch Weapons, all of these face buttons would keep their familiar actions. [LB] would Jump / Hover if held. [RB] would Melee / Spartan Charge if Sprinting / Ground Pound if airborne. (LS) would then be free to toggle Crouch when tapped as well as Crouch when held which would support Gandhi hops. Pushing forward when next to a ledge would automatically Clamber up it. [LT] would Throw Grenades / Fire Secondary Weapon. [RT] would Fire Primary Weapon.

To help visualise my proposal for a supplementary alternative control scheme, I photoshopped this graphic so that the titles were consistent with my recommendation.

[LB] - Jump / Hover (with Thruster Pack) when Held

[LT] - Throw Grenade / Fire Secondary Weapon (if equipped)

(LS) - Move / Strafe and Dodge with Thruster Pack when (X) is Held

(LC) - Crouch

[RB] - Melee Attack / Spartan Charge on release if Held when (X) is Held / Ground Pound on release if Held when airborne

[RT] - Fire Primary Weapon

(Y) - Switch Weapons

(X) - Sprint if (LS) pushed forwards / Dodge if (LS) pushed left or right

(B) - Reload Primary Weapon / Action if Held

(A) - Cycle Grenade / Reload Secondary Weapon (if equipped)

(RS) - Look / Turn

(RC) - Scope (no silly ‘spread reducing’ Smart Scope) / Zoom (no superfluous off-centre reticle)

I welcome any questions, or constructive criticism.

2

Being a bj fan, I always wanted a true return of Grenade cycling to be placed on A. It’s the most natural feeling for me.

I think sprint should be held on A button, so that we keep thruster to X

3

You know you can use your right thumb to quickly hit the d-pad right? That’s what I do with the MCC controls. :stuck_out_tongue:

4

I hate using the dpad to cycle grenades, but I use bumper jumper and I like where everything else is currently…

If we could map out own buttons, I’d use the view button to pause, the dpad to show the scoreboard, and the menu button to cycle grenades… Obviously that wouldn’t work as an official control scheme, but I’d be able to cycle grenades while on the move, while keeping all other actions where they are.

5

I play on recon controls, i prefer them to be on the d-pad.
OP why not choose a diffrent control scheme?

6

> 2533274870591903;5:
> I play on recon controls, i prefer them to be on the d-pad.
> OP why not choose a diffrent control scheme?

cause with recon or non BJ controls you have to take your thumb off the aiming stick to jump. with Bumper jumper i can jump and aim at the same time. and the action button is B so its really close.

7

> SurgeGavelOfate wrote:
>
> Being a bj fan, I always wanted a true of Grenade cycling to be placed on A. It’s the most natural feeling for me.
>
> I think sprint should be held on A button, so that we keep thruster to X

If you meant to say Sprint should be Hold (A), that is already used to Swap your Secondary Weapon with one found on the ground.

The Dodge provided by the Thruster Pack can be provided by Hold (X) in combination with (LS) left or right and works equally well on the ground or in mid-air. There isn’t a need for a separate button to activate the Thruster Pack when a lateral Sprint can be interpreted as a Thruster Pack augmented Dodge and a Ground Pound can be thought of as an aerial Assassination.

Thank you for giving your time this Christmas to respond to my comment. Best wishes for a Happy New Year and I hope you enjoy the Beta on the 29th.

8

> 2533274821174589;2:
> Being a bj fan, I always wanted a true return of Grenade cycling to be placed on A. It’s the most natural feeling for me.I think sprint should be held on A button, so that we keep thruster to X

Clearly you and I are two very different types of BJ fans.

9

> TruP1aya4Real wrote:
>
> I hate using the dpad to cycle grenades… If we could map out own buttons… I’d use… the menu button to cycle grenades… I’d be able to cycle grenades while on the move

Well, PC games often provide options to map out buttons and I’ve even encountered some on console that allow you to do the same. It is a real help. Having to stop moving forward whilst cycling grenades seems to me to be unacceptably clumsy design, but the Thruster Pack doesn’t need a dedicated button as you can currently only Sprint when moving forwards, so the same Sprint button could be used to Dodge sideways - it would feel a little bit like the lateral Dash move in Titanfall. All that is missing is a way to get you to Hover so that you can then either Dodge in the air, or Ground Pound and as the Jump button is normally only tapped, holding it could serve to make you Hover, splitting your operation of the Thruster Pack between [LB] and (X) and (LS) and [RB]. I’m not an advocate of putting Sprint on (LS) Click as it becomes very awkward to Hold whilst moving (LS) sideways compared to Holding it whilst moving (LS) forwards - something I suppose to do with the verticality of the thumb pressing on it.

If there was a way to put Sprint somewhere other than a face button that would be ideal as it would mean that you wouldn’t have to take your right thumb off (RS) for most of the time. As it stands, I think 343i has made their game overcomplicated and a lot of players will invest in fancy SCUF controllers with paddles underneath so that they can keep their thumbs on the sticks as long as possible.

Thank you for giving your time this Christmas to respond to my comment. Best wishes for a Happy New Year and I hope you enjoy the Beta on the 29th.

10

just use your right thumb. it only takes a second

11

> S12 ASHIDO KANO wrote:
>
> I play on recon controls. I prefer them to be on the d-pad.
>
> OP why not choose a different control scheme?

Because there simply isn’t one I like included in any of the options provided by 343I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwpuFDgGcEo

  • The Default control scheme seems like it is designed to avoid alienating players of the Call of Duty / Battlefield franchises in the knowledge that Halo players can always tweak the control scheme to be closer to what they are familiar with. Although, (LS) click is commonly Sprint in these games it doesn’t work with my idea of having a Dodge move when you Strafe rather than push forward and I genuinely feel that it would be very clumsy to attempt to try to have players Dodge by holding (LS) as they Strafe as I think they would have great difficulty keeping (LS) pushed inwards as they angled the stick sideways. I think this is the reason 343i have pragmatically chosen to separate the Thruster Pack so that you push (B) entirely separately from whatever movements you make with (LS). However, along with using (A) to Jump the more face buttons that are used to operate the Thruster Pack the more difficult it will be to track targets with (RS) as your right thumb will not be on it for the majority of the time. Indeed, I’m not all that happy with my solution for having a Thruster Pack lateral Dodge manoeuvre by combining (X) with (LS) Strafe as that means you are momentarily moving your thumb off from holding (RS). There is a solution to this which would require a more fundamental redesign of the game, but I wanted to keep things simple even if it didn’t remove the incentive for players to invest in fancy SCUF controllers with paddles underneath, so they could Sprint and Reload and Cycle Grenades and Switch Weapons without having to take their thumb off (RS) at any point. It also has (RS) click for Crouch as is common in COD’s Tactical and Battlefield 4…- The Southpaw control scheme is very similar to the Default one, just reversing the bumpers and triggers so that Left Handed players fire their Primary Weapon with [LT].- The Boxer control scheme ensures that Melee isn’t in opposition to Fire by putting it on [LT] - I am guessing that some of these layouts are incorrectly labelled - with the Thruster Pack on [LB] and Throw Grenade on [RB] in opposition to Fire, which I could possibly adjust to in time were it not for (A) being my most used Jump / Clamber.- The Bumper Jumper control scheme starts off well by putting my most used Jump action on [LB] where I can readily access it whilst continuously tracking targets with my right thumb remaining on (RS), yet I’m not 100% happy that I can’t Gandhi hop anymore as (LC) hold triggers a Ground Pound when airborne rather than Crouching whilst in mid-air to present a smaller silhouette to the enemy, especially as [RB] Melee hold can be contextually overloaded to mean Ground Pound when airborne as I tend not to Melee opponents in mid-air so I don’t mind if I can only Melee opponents whilst we are both on the ground. The three major gripes I have with what is probably the most Haloish control scheme is firstly having to stop moving to Cycle Grenades (bad) due to their placement on the D-Pad, yes I know people have said that you can stretch to operate this with your right thumb, but I find that ergonomically repulsive and whilst doing that I can only Sprint in a predetermined straight line as even a partial Strafe will cancel my speed, secondly this Sprint is going to be used an awful lot in Halo 5 Guardians so it ought to go somewhere super accessible, but separate from the (LS) stick so that it can be used in combination with it to Dodge sideways, third and finally there simply isn’t any need for another button to activate the Thruster Pack and require me to take my thumb off (RS) at potentially critical moments. Do 343i understand that they are designing controls for a FPS because as far as I can tell my thumb will spend the majority of a match incapable of aiming at anything because of all of these gimmicks they’ve stuffed into it like some horrendous Christmas Turducken.- The Recon control scheme puts Reload onto [RB] which I find to be very weird and a bit of a waste for an action that I don’t need rapid access to given that I tend to only Reload either when I’m in cover whilst my Shield recharges, or running across the map with full Shield to the next piece of cover. I tend not to Melee people all that much as I never seem to win out when they simultaneously Melee me. I have the same issues again with the inconvenient placement of the Jump button and Cycling Grenades.- The Green Thumb control scheme reminds me of that used by the Far Cry games, with (RS) click being Melee and [LT] being the Smart Scope and (B) toggling Crouch. Again, this is no good for me as (A) is Jump / Clamber and I really need it to be on a bumper as I use it more than Melee. If I wasn’t trying to propose a control scheme that was as familiar as possible to players of old Halo games I would have said:[LB] - Jump if tapped with automatic Clamber if (LS) pushed forward when near an edge / Hover if held

[LT] - Throw Grenade if [RB] already held, otherwise: Scope / Fire Secondary Weapon if equipped*

(LS) - Move / Strafe

(LC) - Crouch / Slide if Sprinting

[RB] - Sprint if (LS) pushed forward / Dodge if (LS) pushed left or right

[RT] - Fire Primary Weapon

(Y) - Switch Weapons

(X) - ?

(B) - Reload Primary Weapon / Action if held

(A) - Cycle Grenades / Reload Secondary Weapon if equipped

(RS) - Look / Turn

(RC) - Melee if tapped / Spartan Charge if held and released whilst Sprinting / Ground Pound if held and released whilst airborne

*the Smart Scope would be removed and there wouldn’t even be a Zoom feature, holding [RB] would make your Spartan carry their Primary Weapon across their body stopping them from aiming it should it happen to have a Glass Scope, holding [RB] would similarly affect the way Duel Wielded weapons were carried with them being held “muzzles up” also temporarily inhibited from being able to Fire, the player would have to exit this ‘Quasimode’ by releasing [RB], however, just like how the Alt key on a keyboard temporarily redefines the meaning of the keys so that they no longer produce the letters of the alphabet, holding [RB] then squeezing [LT] without a Secondary Weapon equipped would be overloaded to mean Throw Grenade were any still in your Spartan’s inventory. If you were using the Glass Scope of your Primary Weapon with no Secondary Weapon equipped by holding [LT] and then held [RB] it wouldn’t do anything until you released [LT] to exit Scoped Aim. This would prevent inadvertently Throwing Grenades.

NOTE: that in this scheme (X) is free to be Equipment like in Halo 3, etc.

Also, there could be an option so (LC) and (RC) can be swapped according to personal taste, making it closer to Battlefield 4, etc.

Thank you for your response and best wishes for a Happy New Year, here’s hoping you enjoy the Beta on the 29th.

12

Don’t use Bumper Jumper. The controls are garbage. Why would a super important button like A be used to swapping weapons?

13

> Trio of Kings wrote:
>
> Don’t use Bumper Jumper. The controls are garbage. Why would a super important button like A be used to swapping weapons?

I’ve only just realised it from reading other threads that Halo 5 Guardians lacks dual wielded weapons!!!

This is embarrassing. Yet more dumbing down of the franchise by 343i.

I’d assumed, incorrectly it now seems, that Halo 5 Guardians let you equip and use any weapon you may have optionally equipped in your Spartan’s left hand by squeezing [LT], then Reload this Secondary Weapon by tapping (A), and use the weapon in your Spartan’s right hand by squeezing [RT], then Reload this Primary Weapon by tapping (B), with both being able to be individually swapped with weapons found in the field by holding (A) or (B) correspondingly:

[LT] [RT] - Fire

(A) (B) - Reload / Swap if held

However, Halo 5 Guardians tacks on additional features without integrating them into this familiar Halo control scheme:

[LT] - Smart Scope (dubious feature meant to appeal to Call of Duty players)

[RT] - Fire (you now only get a single Primary weapon, so no John Woo dual wielding epicness, or double mixed weapons)

(B) - Reload / Swap if held

(A) - Jump / Clamber (again like Call of Duty, without even the intelligence to copy Advanced Warfare’s double tap EXO suit to remove all need for a button for the Thruster Pack)

It’s kinda depressing to see every FPS is becoming homogenised into being the exact same game. Even Battlefield 4 Final Stand now has a Railgun just like the one in Halo 4. Presumably, the Publishers funding these expensive AAA FPSes are increasingly risk averse and feel that the safest thing to do is to make their game follow the trend. Halo 4 was very like Call of Duty, with its loadouts and ordinance drops making a mockery of the knowledge needed of the location and respawn times of the weapons on each map as they could be called in from above to any arbitrary location, or just spawn with a Sniper Rifle rather than have to make your way towards this rare Power Weapon whilst risking being attacked by the other team. Thankfully, 343i have learnt from their mistakes with Halo 4, although I’m uncomfortable with the Power Weapon’s location being signposted with a HUD Waypoint and to have the Announcer telling everyone when it is about to appear as if it were a Heavy Ammo drop in Destiny’s Crucible. Ugh! Hopefully, there will be some way to turn off this along with all the fake MLG team chatter it spews forth.

I’ve avoided making a critique of Halo 5 Guardians because I have yet to play it, but it does seem from seeing Twitch.tv videos of the Alpha that you are a bit like a mini Hornet and totally overpowered and grunting as you clamber and dodge and scream your jets before stomping on someone’s head. To find the Outro such a risible Brofest is no surprise yet for all of its gimmicks and eSports ‘shiny’ it lacks the depth and thoughtful character of Halo 3, or the visceral pandemonium of Halo 2, and feels like Combat Regressed not Combat Evolved. It seems as if Mirror’s Edge pushed the Parkour Platformer trope firmly into the consciousness of FPS designers and everyone has been ripping that game off ever since - including things like Prey 2 which sadly got canned despite their great promise. Yet, what is interesting is that if you go back and play Mirror’s Edge you will find that its control scheme is extremely simple and that it even lacks a dedicated Sprint button!

It seems to me that 343i has a ‘everything including the kitchen sink’ attitude to making Halo 5: Guardians, hopeful that something will prove popular with the community during the Beta, when it is actually more likely that their mess of largely inaccessible features will confuse and alienate many prospective purchasers who may not have even played a Halo game before and have no issue with them trying new things. Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare was the Game of the Year in 2014 in my opinion, shipping with no discernable flaws on console, compared to the unmitigated disaster of Halo: The Master Chief Collection, the extremely flaky first year of Battlefield 4, with only Ghosts being okay because it was so extremely cautious about what it attempted to do given the timeframe for development on so very many platforms. Even Destiny’s clunky triple-clicked Titan jetpack jump and Titanfall’s too easy to accomplish wall-running antics echo Mirror’s Edge. No one has an original idea in their head. Even Killzone: Shadow Fall’s OWL innovation is basically Halo 4’s Autosentry armor ability.

I think there is a good chance of many playing the Beta and then going back to Advanced Warfare and thinking that this not only feels exactly the same with its EXO boost dodge but that as they already own Advanced Warfare they have no need for 343i’s apparent carbon copy of its gameplay. So, I don’t know who 343i think they will sell this to as it does not appeal to people new to the series or traditional fans of the early Halo games.

14

It’d be great if you could use a KB&M for this game, that way you can map everything to anything you want.

15

> 2533274808673643;13:
> > Trio of Kings wrote:
> >
> > Don’t use Bumper Jumper. The controls are garbage. Why would a super important button like A be used to swapping weapons?
>
>
>
> I’ve only just realised it from reading other threads that Halo 5 Guardians lacks dual wielded weapons!!!
>
> This is embarrassing. Yet more dumbing down of the franchise by 343i.
>
> I’d assumed, incorrectly it now seems, that Halo 5 Guardians let you equip and use any weapon you may have optionally equipped in your Spartan’s left hand by squeezing [LT], then Reload this Secondary Weapon by tapping (A), and use the weapon in your Spartan’s right hand by squeezing [RT], then Reload this Primary Weapon by tapping (B), with both being able to be individually swapped with weapons found in the field by holding (A) or (B) correspondingly:
>
> [LT] [RT] - Fire
>
> (A) (B) - Reload / Swap if held
>
> However, Halo 5 Guardians tacks on additional features without integrating them into this familiar Halo control scheme:
>
> [LT] - Smart Scope (dubious feature meant to appeal to Call of Duty players)
>
> [RT] - Fire (you now only get a single Primary weapon, so no John Woo dual wielding epicness, or double mixed weapons)
>
> (B) - Reload / Swap if held
>
> (A) - Jump / Clamber (again like Call of Duty, without even the intelligence to copy Advanced Warfare’s double tap EXO suit to remove all need for a button for the Thruster Pack)
>
> It’s kinda depressing to see every FPS is becoming homogenised into being the exact same game. Even Battlefield 4 Final Stand now has a Railgun just like the one in Halo 4. Presumably, the Publishers funding these expensive AAA FPSes are increasingly risk averse and feel that the safest thing to do is to make their game follow the trend. Halo 4 was very like Call of Duty, with its loadouts and ordinance drops making a mockery of the knowledge needed of the location and respawn times of the weapons on each map as they could be called in from above to any arbitrary location, or just spawn with a Sniper Rifle rather than have to make your way towards this rare Power Weapon whilst risking being attacked by the other team. Thankfully, 343i have learnt from their mistakes with Halo 4, although I’m uncomfortable with the Power Weapon’s location being signposted with a HUD Waypoint and to have the Announcer telling everyone when it is about to appear as if it were a Heavy Ammo drop in Destiny’s Crucible. Ugh! Hopefully, there will be some way to turn off this along with all the fake MLG team chatter it spews forth.
>
> I’ve avoided making a critique of Halo 5 Guardians because I have yet to play it, but it does seem from seeing Twitch.tv videos of the Alpha that you are a bit like a mini Hornet and totally overpowered and grunting as you clamber and dodge and scream your jets before stomping on someone’s head. To find the Outro such a risible Brofest is no surprise yet for all of its gimmicks and eSports ‘shiny’ it lacks the depth and thoughtful character of Halo 3, or the visceral pandemonium of Halo 2, and feels like Combat Regressed not Combat Evolved. It seems as if Mirror’s Edge pushed the Parkour Platformer trope firmly into the consciousness of FPS designers and everyone has been ripping that game off ever since - including things like Prey 2 which sadly got canned despite their great promise. Yet, what is interesting is that if you go back and play Mirror’s Edge you will find that its control scheme is extremely simple and that it even lacks a dedicated Sprint button!
>
> It seems to me that 343i has a ‘everything including the kitchen sink’ attitude to making Halo 5: Guardians, hopeful that something will prove popular with the community during the Beta, when it is actually more likely that their mess of largely inaccessible features will confuse and alienate many prospective purchasers who may not have even played a Halo game before and have no issue with them trying new things. Call of Duty: Advanced Warfare was the Game of the Year in 2014 in my opinion, shipping with no discernable flaws on console, compared to the unmitigated disaster of Halo: The Master Chief Collection, the extremely flaky first year of Battlefield 4, with only Ghosts being okay because it was so extremely cautious about what it attempted to do given the timeframe for development on so very many platforms. Even Destiny’s clunky triple-clicked Titan jetpack jump and Titanfall’s too easy to accomplish wall-running antics echo Mirror’s Edge. No one has an original idea in their head. Even Killzone: Shadow Fall’s OWL innovation is basically Halo 4’s Autosentry armor ability.
>
> I think there is a good chance of many playing the Beta and then going back to Advanced Warfare and thinking that this not only feels exactly the same with its EXO boost dodge but that as they already own Advanced Warfare they have no need for 343i’s apparent carbon copy of its gameplay. So, I don’t know who 343i think they will sell this to as it does not appeal to people new to the series or traditional fans of the early Halo games.

Sorry, it feels nothing like COD. It feels like Halo2 with more mobility, but minus the aim-assist. This is coming from a halo fan since CE.

COD is defined by its quick TTK, auto-aim, perks and kill streaks. None of that exists here.