A compromise or change in Multiplayer

Games Halo 5: Guardians
1

Ok, this is geared towards the people that love Halo 4’s multiplayer, but also to the People that like classic Halo. This is a compromise. While some things in Halo 4 were great and brought a new sense to the series, other things left…more to be desired. I shall start with a list of things that need to be removed.

–Remove–
1.)Personal Ordanance drop - There is almost no argument here, POD kind of ruined the game. It’s only nice when YOU yourself get something amazing (ex. Railgun/Binary Rifle).

2.)Camo, Jetpack, Promethean Vision - None of these can properly be balanced. Jetpack isn’t REALLY broken, because the person using it is airborne with no cover, but allows them to get to unreachable camping spots. Camo should be reduced to a power up on the map, promethean vision was originally a deterrent for campers…but instead encouraged them (Stealth w/promethean vision combo).

3.) Support/Tactical Packages that allow traits present in previous games - Things such as resupply were a bad idea. Why take something we could do before and make us use a “perk” to pick up grenades from dead people? It was added to prevent 'nade spamming, but it was still a bad idea. Either let us pick up grenades or don’t, preferably the first choice tho >.>

4.)Plasma Grenades in Custom Loadouts - HORRIBLE decision…Kinda breaks BTB from the start, also for the people that love to spam stickies. Should have stayed a map pick-up. If you’re good with em, more power to you, just no one should be allowed to spawn with them.

5.) Boltshot - Hey look a glowing death pistol of death…this weapon should either be considered a power weapon or a map pick-up. perfect for campers tho…so get the fire ready and get some sticks for your marshmallows. Oh and don’t forget a bug zapper. But in all seriousness, a shotgun off of spawn is incredibly unbalanced.

6.) Plasma pistol - one and done headshot combo off of spawn? ragers beware. This should not have been allowed and should be removed from loadouts. replace with plasma rifle or spiker.

–Keep–
1.) Loadouts - a fresh take, it could use some work, but it doesn’t necessarily need to be removed. The way it worked in Halo 4 was fine, just some things needed to be removed, hence my list above. The primary weapon choice was ok (debatable for DMR and Light Rifle, maybe they should be pickups).

2.) AAs - Make Hologram able to trick more people than the kid who was doing 25 things at the same time, right now it’s just laughable (love the teabagging XD). Make it ACTUALLY do something when you send it out, things a player would do. Thruster pack could use a buff, allowing 2 uses per charge or being able to change direction mid thrust. Hardlight shield should be able to be put away faster. Auto Sentry needs a damage and health buff.

3.) Sprint - Should be kept, it can be competitive, It helps to speed up gameplay, but it can slow it down when against cowardly players. (People complain about how it’s used, then use it that exact same way) It does however help to save you from campers, like that guy with the sniper rifle/Beam Rifle/Binary Rifle/Rocket Launcher/Gravity Hammer/I think you get it.

4.)Tactical/Support - Arguments can be made here, they belong in some senses, things like ammo or firepower, but others can be removed: Grenadier, Shielding, Explosives. Tactical packages and support upgrades are actually pretty good, just need more thinking and balancing put into them.

5.) Random Ordnance - Not in the way that it is now, The same weapons should spawn on the map, but every few spawns randomly switch location. The reason Random ordnance was added was because of complaints of people camping weapon spawns with other power weapons. It is a “strategy” to some, but to new players and veterans it can get REAL annoying. Instead of having random weapons spawn every 2 minutes, it should remain the same weapons, just every 2-3 times move to a different weapon’s spawn on the map.

I will add more as the thread goes on and i gain insight from your comments

2

> 2.)Camo, Jetpack, Promethean Vision - None of these can properly be balanced.

But why stop here? All current AA’s have balance issues. If we keep AA’s on spawn I’d like them to remove the current concepts and think up new ones.

> But in all seriousness, a shotgun off of spawn is incredibly unbalanced.

Depends on the game’s sandbox design. In Call of Duty a one hit kill shotgun works because all other guns kill at about the same speed.

I feel a three shot kill tight shotgun could work as a spawn option (provided melee lunge is also removed). Guarantee it would be a more competitive option than the Assault Rifle.

> 1.) Loadouts

Agree they don’t need to be removed, disagree they were executed fine (even with just primary selection).

> 2.) AAs

No to all, especially sentry.

> 3.) Sprint

No.

First of all, of course people use it to run away. You would be gimping yourself if you didn’t. That doesn’t make the fact you can use it to run away acceptable.

Second, doesn’t speed up gameplay.

> 4.)Tactical packages and support upgrades are actually pretty good, just need more thinking and balancing put into them.

Invisible buffs that the enemy has no impact on. Bad.

3

> > 2.)Camo, Jetpack, Promethean Vision - None of these can properly be balanced.
>
> But why stop here? All current AA’s have balance issues. If we keep AA’s on spawn I’d like them to remove the current concepts and think up new ones.
>
>
>
> > But in all seriousness, a shotgun off of spawn is incredibly unbalanced.
>
> Depends on the game’s sandbox design. In Call of Duty a one hit kill shotgun works because all other guns kill at about the same speed.
>
> I feel a three shot kill tight shotgun could work as a spawn option (provided melee lunge is also removed). Guarantee it would be a more competitive option than the Assault Rifle.
>
>
>
> > 1.) Loadouts
>
> Agree they don’t need to be removed, disagree they were executed fine (even with just primary selection).
>
>
>
> > 2.) AAs
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> No to all, especially sentry.
>
>
>
> > 3.) Sprint
>
> No.
>
> First of all, of course people use it to run away. You would be gimping yourself if you didn’t. That doesn’t make the fact you can use it to run away acceptable.
>
> Second, doesn’t speed up gameplay.
>
>
>
> > 4.)Tactical packages and support upgrades are actually pretty good, just need more thinking and balancing put into them.
>
> Invisible buffs that the enemy has no impact on. Bad.

I couldn’t really think of what to say about support and tactical upgrades. They arent a bad IDEA, just the options they gave were bad. Things like firepower and Ammo were good examples of how they should have been instead of dexterity and sensor.

I tried not to bring COD into this because the kill times are a lot different, but yes if it was a 3-shot kill shotgun-type then maybe i could see it being in with no complaints.

Sprint can speed up gameplay, if used to get back into he action. Of course everyone uses it to run tho, i gave examples of when and why people use it to run. So far the only AA’s that are “balanced” are Hologram, Thruster pack, and Hardlight shield. but they could all use some tweaks.

By loadout I meant the layout, it was executed fine. the selections in the loadouts could be better, but i felt the Primary weapons were ok, but could’ve been better

4

> 4.)Plasma Grenades in Custom Loadouts - HORRIBLE decision…Kinda breaks BTB from the start, also for the people that love to spam stickies. Should have stayed a map pick-up. If you’re good with em, more power to you, just no one should be allowed to spawn with them.

I think the PGs could stay as load out options. If you take the PP’s EMP out of the equation then that solves half of the problem and giving us only one instead of two couldn’t hurt either.

And Fos Kuvol’s idea to have them only become sticky a little bit after being thrown would be nice too. It’d do a lot to stop suicide stickers and adds more of a skill gap to getting stick kills over all.

> 5.) Boltshot - Hey look a glowing death pistol of death…this weapon should either be considered a power weapon or a map pick-up. perfect for campers tho…so get the fire ready and get some sticks for your marshmallows. Oh and don’t forget a bug zapper. But in all seriousness, a shotgun off of spawn is incredibly unbalanced.
>
> 6.) Plasma pistol - one and done headshot combo off of spawn? ragers beware. This should not have been allowed and should be removed from loadouts. replace with plasma rifle or spiker.

IMO you’re suggestions here are all mixed up. A Spiker or a PR (and by extension of that an SMG) could be considered a good replacement for the Bolt shot, not the PP.

The side arm automatics would more readily fit into the Bolt shot’s role as a CQC side arm rather then the PPs role as an enemy weakener. Though I suppose this is all based on my opinion of what roles 343 intended for the side arms to play. But in what way can the PR or Spiker replace fill the role that PP plays anyway?

And seeing the Bolt shot replaced with a small automatic is definitely something I’d like to see.

As for what I think should actually be done with the PP? IMO replacing it with it’s CE incarnation would be the most appealing option. It’ll still fill it’s role as an enemy weakener but it removes the EMP, on top of that getting those commendation kills will be a lot easier.

Making some EMP based power weapons could be a good way of keeping EMPs in the game too. It’d be a good excuse to bring the Grenade launcher back.

As for your other points I either agree, am undecided or am indifferent about it.

5

You sir are my favourite person. Your post is exactly what I thought. :slight_smile:

Just stay away from the Teen Titans.

6

I like most of your comments, but not all.

IMO,

If AA become map pickups, the PV would no longer be OP.

Active Camo should return as a Powerup, along with Overshield, Speed Boost and Damage Boost.

I still think Custom Loadouts works in Halo and can keep Halo an Arena Shooter. And totally agree with the weapons you mention do not belong in loadouts. Remove these and DMR/LR. Then loadouts are balanced and do not ruin map movement.

Regarding PERKS, they should be just removed. As long as your getting kills, you should be able to collect ammo from your enemies, and maybe ammo boxes like we had in Fire Fight or H4 campaign could be scattered around the maps. This would however only replenish ammo for non power weapons.

H4 does have many pros, but also many cons. Take the pros, remove the cons, and return to H3 Arena Game Play and we have a winner.

7

> > 4.)Plasma Grenades in Custom Loadouts - HORRIBLE decision…Kinda breaks BTB from the start, also for the people that love to spam stickies. Should have stayed a map pick-up. If you’re good with em, more power to you, just no one should be allowed to spawn with them.
>
> I think the PGs could stay as load out options. If you take the PP’s EMP out of the equation then that solves half of the problem and giving us only one instead of two couldn’t hurt either.
>
> And Fos Kuvol’s idea to have them only become sticky a little bit after being thrown would be nice too. It’d do a lot to stop suicide stickers and adds more of a skill gap to getting stick kills over all.

Removing the EMP from the Plasma Pistol, would make the PP useless. This was the best thing added to the PP.

I think that a charged blast from the PP should deplenish all AA fuel. I think the PP EMP should be more powerful and disable vehicles for longer as long as it returned as a map pickup and was a rare item, like it was in all previous Halo games.

8

> > > 4.)Plasma Grenades in Custom Loadouts - HORRIBLE decision…Kinda breaks BTB from the start, also for the people that love to spam stickies. Should have stayed a map pick-up. If you’re good with em, more power to you, just no one should be allowed to spawn with them.
> >
> > I think the PGs could stay as load out options. If you take the PP’s EMP out of the equation then that solves half of the problem and giving us only one instead of two couldn’t hurt either.
> >
> > And Fos Kuvol’s idea to have them only become sticky a little bit after being thrown would be nice too. It’d do a lot to stop suicide stickers and adds more of a skill gap to getting stick kills over all.
>
> Removing the EMP from the Plasma Pistol, would make the PP useless. This was the best thing added to the PP.
>
> I think that a charged blast from the PP should deplenish all AA fuel. I think the PP EMP should be more powerful and disable vehicles for longer as long as it returned as a map pickup and was a rare item, like it was in all previous Halo games.

But if we use the CE version it would still be useful.

Instead of the charged bolt causing an EMP it’ll stick to the target delivering continuous damage for a few seconds.

This way the PP will still accomplish it’s role in load outs as an enemy weakener while also removing the issues it causes to vehicle combat. The CE version also has a lot more potential to kill so it’ll make commendation kills less of an issue as well.

The EMP effect should be moved over to power weapons like the Grenade launcher or maybe some new ones.

But if you’re that adamant about having the PP spawn on the map there’ll need to be a replacement for it in load outs. Perhaps something like a Flame pistol could work as a new enemy weakener. Or perhaps a Sentinel beam could fill that role some how.

P.S Regarding your thoughts on removing the long range rifles from load outs. I made a thread discussing it. It’s a bit of read but I’d love to get some of your input on why the long range rifles can’t possibly work. Link!

9

I think Loadouts can work if they’re literally just for preference and not playstyle. Meaning that what you pick doesn’t actually matter all that much. In short, everything you spawn with actually does the same thing as everything else in that slot more or less.

The illusion of choice.

First of all, perks should go. Just give everyone the same stats.

Primaries: Personally, I feel that Forerunner weapons should be power weapons but that’s personal want. All primary weapons need to be more or less effective at the same ranges. For guns like the Battle Rifle, Carbine and DMR, all work at mid-range with leanings towards short and long. The automatics however, all range out at short. This is when disparity starts. Make the automatics similar to the ODST SMG with its scope. That way, all primaries can work up to at least mid range. Obviously, balance tweaks would be needed, but the principle works.

Secondaries: Magnum was fine. Plasma Pistol could use a normal shot buff and an overcharge nerf (make killing vehicles require teamwork).

AAs: Now, I think AAs can work. Jetpack needs to be removed or made into a universal double-jump, since it actually has the same problem Sprint did in Reach. Active Camo should be like Halo 3’s Cloaking: ten seconds of good camo, for getting a quick drop or moving across dangerous open ground. Not camping. Autosentry and Regen Field could do with some reassessment. General idea: make AAs have less impact on movement and combat. Throwaway buffs if you will.

Grenades: Only spawn with one. Frags detonate if a direct hit on an enemy or vehicle. Plasma has the same strength as a frag when not stuck. Pulse and other grenades should be reassessed or replaced.

Basically, the idea is to narrow the gap between different loadout choices. To create an illusion that what you pick matters.

Would anyone else agree? This seems like a working compromise at least.