A bigger issue than the AA vs KBM debate

The controller/AA vs KBM and cross play debate has gone on forever, but i think keeping them separate in competitive is the right call, they cant be balanced. The bigger issue is, if infinite drops and brings in a large amount of players, what, if anything will 343 do about the tons of Cronusmax/zen, Strike pack, ximm, and venom users that will do doubt flood the game? As has been the case in many other shooters like, Apex, Warzone, Overwatch and many more. These products give AA on KBM, O recoil, extra AA, animation cancelling, rapid fire, aim correction, and other scrips that basically do the work for you. They are the same as pc cheats, only downloaded and hid behind an adapter that makes itself look like a regular controller. I want Infinite to be big and successful but big games bring a lot of these no skill cheats trying to get an edge. Then when nothing is done more people start using them just to compete and eventually ruins the game.

That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo

Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.

As lame as all that sounds, I highly doubt it’ll end up being a major issue. If Infinite has a healthy population, that largely reduces the odds you’ll run into someone running around with stuff like that. If the population’s bad, then the odds go up. More people around = less odds of running into the Bad Eggs.

> 2533274882898126;2:
> That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo
>
> Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.

exactly, why even bother playing a game if you need mods to do all the work for you. Ya, they can brag about a high level or how many games they win, but without having the legit skill to back it up, whats the point lol. But its common enough in most big fps games that it ruins the experience for a lot of players.

> 2533274850869596;3:
> As lame as all that sounds, I highly doubt it’ll end up being a major issue. If Infinite has a healthy population, that largely reduces the odds you’ll run into someone running around with stuff like that. If the population’s bad, then the odds go up. More people around = less odds of running into the Bad Eggs.

you underestimate how many people are using them. Its already a pretty big problem in most all the popular fps right now.

> 2763816199912979;5:
> > 2533274850869596;3:
> > As lame as all that sounds, I highly doubt it’ll end up being a major issue. If Infinite has a healthy population, that largely reduces the odds you’ll run into someone running around with stuff like that. If the population’s bad, then the odds go up. More people around = less odds of running into the Bad Eggs.
>
> you underestimate how many people are using them. Its already a pretty big problem in most all the popular fps right now.

If it really is a problem in most all popular FPS’es, then it’ll be a ‘problem’ for Infinite too - it being 343/Halo doesn’t mean they’ll magically be able to stop it from happening here if it’s so commonplace everywhere else. If anything, it being as widespread as you’re saying means they won’t be able to do anything about it. If they could, then surely the other big FPS games would have too, and it wouldn’t be a problem then?

> 2763816199912979;1:
> The controller/AA vs KBM and cross play debate has gone on forever, but i think keeping them separate in competitive is the right call, they cant be balanced. The bigger issue is, if infinite drops and brings in a large amount of players, what, if anything will 343 do about the tons of Cronusmax/zen, Strike pack, ximm, and venom users that will do doubt flood the game? As has been the case in many other shooters like, Apex, Warzone, Overwatch and many more. These products give AA on KBM, O recoil, extra AA, animation cancelling, rapid fire, aim correction, and other scrips that basically do the work for you. They are the same as pc cheats, only downloaded and hid behind an adapter that makes itself look like a regular controller. I want Infinite to be big and successful but big games bring a lot of these no skill cheats trying to get an edge. Then when nothing is done more people start using them just to compete and eventually ruins the game.

Yeah anyone who thinks AA is bad is crazy if they think Xim controllers aren’t complete BS.

AA is nothing comparatively.

That’s a risk, but that’s an issue no one really has a solve for. Hope we don’t have too many issues but that’s not an easy thing to fix

> 2763816199912979;4:
> > 2533274882898126;2:
> > That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo
> >
> > Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.
>
> exactly, why even bother playing a game if you need mods to do all the work for you. Ya, they can brag about a high level or how many games they win, but without having the legit skill to back it up, whats the point lol. But its common enough in most big fps games that it ruins the experience for a lot of players.

As someone who’s above average in skill for Halo, part of me looks forward to seeing those -Yoinks!-. What a challenge, fighting someone with inhuman ability. If I can outperform that, It’ll put a big smile on my face.
I’d rather avoid it altogether though

> 2533274891007534;8:
> That’s a risk, but that’s an issue no one really has a solve for. Hope we don’t have too many issues but that’s not an easy thing to fix

> 2533274882898126;9:
> > 2763816199912979;4:
> > > 2533274882898126;2:
> > > That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo
> > >
> > > Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.
> >
> > exactly, why even bother playing a game if you need mods to do all the work for you. Ya, they can brag about a high level or how many games they win, but without having the legit skill to back it up, whats the point lol. But its common enough in most big fps games that it ruins the experience for a lot of players.
>
> As someone who’s above average in skill for Halo, part of me looks forward to seeing those -Yoinks!-. What a challenge, fighting someone with inhuman ability. If I can outperform that, It’ll put a big smile on my face.
> I’d rather avoid it altogether though

Guess reporting’s the only thing that’ll produce any real results, unless 343 can come up with some unexpected solution. Sooner or later the reports will pile up and they’ll have harder and harder time finding games or getting more and more matchmaking ban timeouts, eventually some of them will throw up their hands and go to some other game where it’s easier for them to have their “fun”.

I mean, genuinely good players sometimes end up on the receiving end of that from sour people, so you’d imagine how many reports someone outright cheating would end up receiving. Pair that with Halo’s mighty strict and unyielding Ban System, and I figure a lot of them will as said, head somewhere else. They’ll always be around of course, nothing’s going to change that, but I feel that it won’t be something that’ll kill Infinite’s multiplayer scene. If it does get bad, 343 can always ask for help from Microsoft - one of the benefits of being the overseer of a large franchise. You got friends in high places :stuck_out_tongue:

> 2533274850869596;10:
> > 2533274891007534;8:
> > That’s a risk, but that’s an issue no one really has a solve for. Hope we don’t have too many issues but that’s not an easy thing to fix
>
>
>
> > 2533274882898126;9:
> > > 2763816199912979;4:
> > > > 2533274882898126;2:
> > > > That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo
> > > >
> > > > Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.
> > >
> > > exactly, why even bother playing a game if you need mods to do all the work for you. Ya, they can brag about a high level or how many games they win, but without having the legit skill to back it up, whats the point lol. But its common enough in most big fps games that it ruins the experience for a lot of players.
> >
> > As someone who’s above average in skill for Halo, part of me looks forward to seeing those -Yoinks!-. What a challenge, fighting someone with inhuman ability. If I can outperform that, It’ll put a big smile on my face.
> > I’d rather avoid it altogether though
>
> Guess reporting’s the only thing that’ll produce any real results, unless 343 can come up with some unexpected solution. Sooner or later the reports will pile up and they’ll have harder and harder time finding games or getting more and more matchmaking ban timeouts, eventually some of them will throw up their hands and go to some other game where it’s easier for them to have their “fun”.
>
> I mean, genuinely good players sometimes end up on the receiving end of that from sour people, so you’d imagine how many reports someone outright cheating would end up receiving. Pair that with Halo’s mighty strict and unyielding Ban System, and I figure a lot of them will as said, head somewhere else. They’ll always be around of course, nothing’s going to change that, but I feel that it won’t be something that’ll kill Infinite’s multiplayer scene. If it does get bad, 343 can always ask for help from Microsoft - one of the benefits of being the overseer of a large franchise. You got friends in high places :stuck_out_tongue:

Unfortunately a report doesn’t mean a punishment. It means review, but if they can’t find the actual technical evidence, it most likely will get passed over or simply cancelled.

> 2533274797661806;11:
> > 2533274850869596;10:
> > > 2533274891007534;8:
> > > That’s a risk, but that’s an issue no one really has a solve for. Hope we don’t have too many issues but that’s not an easy thing to fix
> >
> >
> >
> > > 2533274882898126;9:
> > > > 2763816199912979;4:
> > > > > 2533274882898126;2:
> > > > > That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo
> > > > >
> > > > > Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.
> > > >
> > > > exactly, why even bother playing a game if you need mods to do all the work for you. Ya, they can brag about a high level or how many games they win, but without having the legit skill to back it up, whats the point lol. But its common enough in most big fps games that it ruins the experience for a lot of players.
> > >
> > > As someone who’s above average in skill for Halo, part of me looks forward to seeing those -Yoinks!-. What a challenge, fighting someone with inhuman ability. If I can outperform that, It’ll put a big smile on my face.
> > > I’d rather avoid it altogether though
> >
> > Guess reporting’s the only thing that’ll produce any real results, unless 343 can come up with some unexpected solution. Sooner or later the reports will pile up and they’ll have harder and harder time finding games or getting more and more matchmaking ban timeouts, eventually some of them will throw up their hands and go to some other game where it’s easier for them to have their “fun”.
> >
> > I mean, genuinely good players sometimes end up on the receiving end of that from sour people, so you’d imagine how many reports someone outright cheating would end up receiving. Pair that with Halo’s mighty strict and unyielding Ban System, and I figure a lot of them will as said, head somewhere else. They’ll always be around of course, nothing’s going to change that, but I feel that it won’t be something that’ll kill Infinite’s multiplayer scene. If it does get bad, 343 can always ask for help from Microsoft - one of the benefits of being the overseer of a large franchise. You got friends in high places :stuck_out_tongue:
>
> Unfortunately a report doesn’t mean a punishment. It means review, but if they can’t find the actual technical evidence, it most likely will get passed over or simply cancelled.

A review would still yield results, unless the person doing the review is too indifferent to really care or just glosses over it. From what I understand, these modded controllers let you do things that should otherwise be impossible, so if they look over it and see impossible feats being pulled off, then it could go somewhere.

Still, I hear ‘Cheaters! Modded Controllers!! Haxxs!!!’ be talked about for days on games like Battlefield 4, and then someone else comes up and says “I’ve been playing for weeks, I only saw like two cases of outright cheating” with all the other games being normal or stomped by genuinely skilled players. My experience on the MCC has thus far been the same in the past three or four months - a lot of normal games, some “Oh, you matched against a full team / some people who REALLY know what they’re doing” but haven’t seen any of these cheaters I keep hearing horror stories about. Or if I have run into one, I obliviously missed it.

Honestly, I’m not too terribly worried about this being a game-killing issue here for more or less that reason. Unless of course, Infinite’s population ends up being really low for whatever reason. Plus, 343i seems a bit more interested in addressing issues like this than ah, some other games I’ve played with PvP in the past.

> 2763816199912979;5:
> > 2533274850869596;3:
> > As lame as all that sounds, I highly doubt it’ll end up being a major issue. If Infinite has a healthy population, that largely reduces the odds you’ll run into someone running around with stuff like that. If the population’s bad, then the odds go up. More people around = less odds of running into the Bad Eggs.
>
> you underestimate how many people are using them. Its already a pretty big problem in most all the popular fps right now.

What do you think is the percentage of people using modded controllers on Xbox for FPS games like Halo, Apex, CoD, Destiny, et cetera?

> 2763816199912979;4:
> > 2533274882898126;2:
> > That sounds terrible. Man, imagine being so bad at the game that you have to use a modded controller to get wins lmaooo
> >
> > Halo has always been pretty good about it’s banhammer. No doubt they’ll get reported enough to get booted. Idk man, it’s hard to fight that stuff and i’m not familiar with that kind of thing at all.
>
> exactly, why even bother playing a game if you need mods to do all the work for you. Ya, they can brag about a high level or how many games they win, but without having the legit skill to back it up, whats the point lol. But its common enough in most big fps games that it ruins the experience for a lot of players.

It’s the same dudes who lie about having fast cars. For five minutes people tell them they are great. Their stream count goes up because people think they have skills until it’s inevitably revealed they are Cheaters.

Off topic, but if KBM was an option for Halo back in the days when I started playin, I would’ve played nd gotten good on that. Aim is superior on that mug.

> 2533274920070188;13:
> > 2763816199912979;5:
> > > 2533274850869596;3:
> > > As lame as all that sounds, I highly doubt it’ll end up being a major issue. If Infinite has a healthy population, that largely reduces the odds you’ll run into someone running around with stuff like that. If the population’s bad, then the odds go up. More people around = less odds of running into the Bad Eggs.
> >
> > you underestimate how many people are using them. Its already a pretty big problem in most all the popular fps right now.
>
> What do you think is the percentage of people using modded controllers on Xbox for FPS games like Halo, Apex, CoD, Destiny, et cetera?

Not sure what the percentage of players would be, but its large enough to be a well known issues in those communities, especially warzone and apex atm. I was reading a post on it a while back talking about how using mods and cheats like that was hard to detect because of how they are done by mimicking a regular controller so knowing a true number of users is almost impossible, Then they went on to add how if the number of downloads for the zero recoil, aim correction and other scripts for those devices from the cronusmax is an indicator, then the numbers are probably decently high.

My whole thing is, why even play a game at all if you need to cheat or have a mod doing the work for you? lol Is the post game report & stats really more important to players than actually getting good at the game with real skill. And for people who are playing legit and trying to get better it sucks having to go up against these people.

> 2535436557871072;15:
> Off topic, but if KBM was an option for Halo back in the days when I started playin, I would’ve played nd gotten good on that. Aim is superior on that mug.

Aim is definitely better, and so is turn/sensitivity while not needing to sacrifice accuracy. I just always preferred controller in fps, i like pulling a trigger as apposed to clicking a mouse. Its more immersive. Also KBM always felt too easy, getting to top levels of play with controller always seemed more impressive to me lol. Like seeing what all the old halo 2 pros could do with a controller was always cooler to see than seeing headshot snipe montages on a mouse. Alot of games i play on my PC with KBM but i always go to console/controller for my shooters

> 2533274850869596;3:
> As lame as all that sounds, I highly doubt it’ll end up being a major issue. If Infinite has a healthy population, that largely reduces the odds you’ll run into someone running around with stuff like that. If the population’s bad, then the odds go up. More people around = less odds of running into the Bad Eggs.

You’re not wrong, more people will dilute the cronus player pool. However, the higher you go in sbmm, I think it’s safe to assume that the ratio of cronus users gets higher and higher. I’m a fairly decent cod warzone player (2.6 k/d, couple hundred wins) on PC with MKB and I run into Cronus’s more and more now. I can see it being a massive problem in Halo since tracking is so important.

> 2763816199912979;17:
> > 2535436557871072;15:
> > Off topic, but if KBM was an option for Halo back in the days when I started playin, I would’ve played nd gotten good on that. Aim is superior on that mug.
>
> Aim is definitely better, and so is turn/sensitivity while not needing to sacrifice accuracy. I just always preferred controller in fps, i like pulling a trigger as apposed to clicking a mouse. Its more immersive. Also KBM always felt too easy, getting to top levels of play with controller always seemed more impressive to me lol. Like seeing what all the old halo 2 pros could do with a controller was always cooler to see than seeing headshot snipe montages on a mouse. Alot of games i play on my PC with KBM but i always go to console/controller for my shooters

Yeah it’s more impressive on controller, I agree…