Now this is all what I feel, and I could be completely wrong and 343 just wants to inform us of different aspects of Halo Infinite.
But I feel as if 343i is spending more time than needed on this campaign. Its no secret that majority of player’s time is spent in the multiplayer. Regardless if you play a lot of campaign, one run of it, or never at all. I feel with Halo infinite being a live service game with the intended lifespan of 10 years, the multiplayer has to come out the gate swinging as hard as possible. - Personally I believe that playable elites and dual wielding would have helped with that, since they’ve has been a desired features for quite a long time. Many ague that its a waste of resources and its hard to balance. What I haven’t seen a lot of people talk about is the existence of Social vs Ranked playlists. What I mean by this is, although ranked is great and you to flex your skills. Social game types help ppl lay back and have fun without worry of sweating. This is where dual wielding and playable elites come in. - Dual wielding can be in: Campaign, Social Playlists, Firefight, and Custom Games. While Playable Elites can be in: Social playlists/Invasion, Firefight, Campaign DLC, and custom games. This is not a waste of resources nor would be so hard to balance, for example you could have certain weapons be duel wieldable with dmg tweaked for the playlists. - Without making this post too long, I disagree heavily with 343i decision and excuse we were given for playable elites and not having duel wielding. A “spartan story” is what led me to believe that too much time is going into the Campaign. - On a side note I don’t use playable elites and dual wielding was something I mainly used in campaign. Its just with the time 343i has had with this game I don’t think its wrong to expect a game with a lot of features. - One more thing: I also don’t see many people talking about how 343i are redesigning weapons, removing and replacing weapons as a waste of resources but playable elites and dual wielding are.
I think it all comes down to what 343 feels will have a much bigger impact in the short run leading up to release. It would have been nice to see playable elites and dual wielding at launch but perhaps they will come later. In regards to 343 focusing on designing weapons and choosing which weapons to include in the sandbox at launch, I feel that would be a bigger impact on the game than playable elites. Elites are at the end of the day mostly a cosmetic choice, especially if their hitbox is balanced correctly, but something like how the BR or pistol will operate within the game has a much more noticeable impact on gameplay. 343 would also have to design a whole set of armors specifically for Elites, which would take resources and time. I have more hope that things like playable elites and dual wielding can be implemented after launch, especially with Infinite being a live-service game of sorts, but the reality is there is only so much time in the day for developers to do stuff. Plus I think its more important that developers can have a good work-life balance rather than being forced to work nonstop up until release.
I am very excited about the returned focus on campaign, but I hear your concerns. I hope 343 can find a good balance and judging them before we see the product is a bit difficult in my opinion.
I truly see both sides to this argument. And honestly if I can get through the boring grind to 152 in Halo 5 multiplayer I can get through a “decent” Halo Infinite multiplayer without elites as long as it has an amazing story/campaign.
I’d actually be a bit more worried if 343 were spending an inordinate amount of time and resources on things that pretty much only cater to a very small, niche part of the community. No matter how vocal they are.
It’s actually comforting to hear them talking about getting the basics right first.
Honestly, I already know the story won’t live up to the Halo name. To be frank, after Halo 3 the story feels finished. Everything happening after just doesn’t feel important. I feel the same way in that multiplayer should be the primary focus of the game. Hell I wouldn’t even hate it if Halo Infinite was just going to be a more refined Halo Online. If they wanted to throw in campaign/story it should have taken the approach Bungie took post Halo 3; taking smaller stories from the Halo universe and turning them into fleshed out playable campaigns.
> 2533274902469708;1:
> Now this is all what I feel, and I could be completely wrong and 343 just wants to inform us of different aspects of Halo Infinite.
>
>
> - But I feel as if 343i is spending more time than needed on this campaign. Its no secret that majority of player’s time is spent in the multiplayer. Regardless if you play a lot of campaign, one run of it, or never at all. I feel with Halo infinite being a live service game with the intended lifespan of 10 years, the multiplayer has to come out the gate swinging as hard as possible. - Personally I believe that playable elites and dual wielding would have helped with that, since they’ve has been a desired features for quite a long time. Many ague that its a waste of resources and its hard to balance. What I haven’t seen a lot of people talk about is the existence of Social vs Ranked playlists. What I mean by this is, although ranked is great and you to flex your skills. Social game types help ppl lay back and have fun without worry of sweating. This is where dual wielding and playable elites come in. - Dual wielding can be in: Campaign, Social Playlists, Firefight, and Custom Games. While Playable Elites can be in: Social playlists/Invasion, Firefight, Campaign DLC, and custom games. This is not a waste of resources nor would be so hard to balance, for example you could have certain weapons be duel wieldable with dmg tweaked for the playlists. - Without making this post too long, I disagree heavily with 343i decision and excuse we were given for playable elites and not having duel wielding. A “spartan story” is what led me to believe that too much time is going into the Campaign. - On a side note I don’t use playable elites and dual wielding was something I mainly used in campaign. Its just with the time 343i has had with this game I don’t think its wrong to expect a game with a lot of features. - One more thing: I also don’t see many people talking about how 343i are redesigning weapons, removing and replacing weapons as a waste of resources but playable elites and dual wielding are.
As much a lot of this may be true to a lot of players, I find myself in the position to master the campaign before I touch the multiplayer. I believe, that the campaign was completed a while back and they are working on mainly the multiplayer and textures, audio and things alike. I believe 343 has hit the Mark and are going above and beyond. As much as it is disappointing that there will be no duel wielding or playable elites, it does not mean they will not come in the future as it is a live game. For all halo lovers alike, this game will be hot and ready right out of the oven when it releases. As opposed to last year, they would have released a half baked game per say. I think when it comes to redesign of weapons, my take on the art style is they are taking it back to a much simpler concept. New, but as if this was the true sequel art wise to halo 3. I see it as being less like trying to go for realistic, and sticking to the skin they were made on if that makes sense.
> 2533274840624875;3:
> I dont mean to be that guy, but there are a ton of elite and dual-wielding threads
That’s not the only statement made in this thread but I hear ya. The bigger point of what im saying and I guess I should have spelled it out for you, is will we have a finished product on release? Or will 343i use the “Live-Service” as an excuse to spoon-feed us content.
Halo Reach launched with: Full campaign, Multiplayer, Firefight, Forge, Theater, File Share, Commendations(milestones/in-game progression), and playable elites. And Playable Elites added more content to both multiplayer and firefight.
> 2585548714655118;6:
> I’d actually be a bit more worried if 343 were spending an inordinate amount of time and resources on things that pretty much only cater to a very small, niche part of the community. No matter how vocal they are.
>
> It’s actually comforting to hear them talking about getting the basics right first.
>
> Cream and sugar can be added later.
I feel you because I said before I didnt really use these features all the time either, I just cant convince myself that 343i couldn’t have pulled it off. They aren’t an indie studio and I personally feel that too many people give them that treatment. But as long as the multiplayer side of Halo is strong on release, thats really all im asking for. I dont want another Halo 5 on release.
> 2533274866022405;2:
> I think it all comes down to what 343 feels will have a much bigger impact in the short run leading up to release. It would have been nice to see playable elites and dual wielding at launch but perhaps they will come later. In regards to 343 focusing on designing weapons and choosing which weapons to include in the sandbox at launch, I feel that would be a bigger impact on the game than playable elites. Elites are at the end of the day mostly a cosmetic choice, especially if their hitbox is balanced correctly, but something like how the BR or pistol will operate within the game has a much more noticeable impact on gameplay. 343 would also have to design a whole set of armors specifically for Elites, which would take resources and time. I have more hope that things like playable elites and dual wielding can be implemented after launch, especially with Infinite being a live-service game of sorts, but the reality is there is only so much time in the day for developers to do stuff. Plus I think its more important that developers can have a good work-life balance rather than being forced to work nonstop up until release.
When it comes to a “good work-life” in a triple A studio, I don’t think a lot of people understand how these things work. 343i is funded by Microsoft and has a large team behind them. Many people treat not only 343i like indie devs but other triple A companies as well. its not 4 or 5 people struggling throughout the development cycle of these types of games. More times than not other factors such as higher ups forcing rebuilds, disputes within the team, delegating resources over unfinished products, and other factors go into development hell. Im not necessarily upset about Elites or dual wielding, I feel as if they are excuses and it worries me a bit about how 343i will launch and support Halo infinite in the future. Like will we have true firefight again? Or some gimmick to sell micro-transactions? Will 343i give us an actual finished product? Or use the “live service” as an excuse to release an unfinished product and spoon feed us content?
> 2535419263744226;5:
> I truly see both sides to this argument. And honestly if I can get through the boring grind to 152 in Halo 5 multiplayer I can get through a “decent” Halo Infinite multiplayer without elites as long as it has an amazing story/campaign.
We don’t need a decent Multiplayer, we need an excellent multiplayer. That’s what holds player counts far longer than the campaign, like I said before I’ve played a lot of campaign. I even played a decent amount of Halo 4 campaign and I didn’t even enjoy it as much as titles before it. But Halo 4 numbers dropped due to its multiplayer. Will 343i story really be worth 60 bucks now that the multiplayer is free? I don’t think so honestly.
> 2533274863380818;7:
> Honestly, I already know the story won’t live up to the Halo name. To be frank, after Halo 3 the story feels finished. Everything happening after just doesn’t feel important. I feel the same way in that multiplayer should be the primary focus of the game. Hell I wouldn’t even hate it if Halo Infinite was just going to be a more refined Halo Online. If they wanted to throw in campaign/story it should have taken the approach Bungie took post Halo 3; taking smaller stories from the Halo universe and turning them into fleshed out playable campaigns.
Glad to see someone sees what im saying, 343i should have heavily focused on what worked with Halo 3 and Reaches multiplayer and see what didn’t, mainly them damn abilities. With this decade long serviced game (which has not worked in the past, look at destiny, anthem, and so on) campaign expansions could easily come later. Give us a simple and flushed out story to begin with and build on that later. Hell it would take nearly 10 years to fix the lore, unless all of Halo 5 and the lore excuses for design changes were just thrown away.
I see that a few people believe me to be a Duel wield and Playable Elite guy.
So I’m going to clear the water, my original post talks about how these two features are not a waste of resources and they add to the over all experience in more than just one game mode. And neither are the people wanting this a very small portion of the community, thats like saying those who want 343i to drop abilities and return to a more classic experience are a small number. Regardless if you use it or have no desire for them, does not mean you can discredit the amount of people who do.
Lastly and I’ll be blunt, If Halo infinite does not launch with at bare minimum, all the features Reach launched with plus a ranked playlist(because 3 did a better job in this regard) then 343i has failed the multiplayer aspect of Infinite on launch.
> 2533274902469708;1:
> Now this is all what I feel, and I could be completely wrong and 343 just wants to inform us of different aspects of Halo Infinite.
>
>
> - But I feel as if 343i is spending more time than needed on this campaign. Its no secret that majority of player’s time is spent in the multiplayer. Regardless if you play a lot of campaign, one run of it, or never at all. I feel with Halo infinite being a live service game with the intended lifespan of 10 years, the multiplayer has to come out the gate swinging as hard as possible. - Personally I believe that playable elites and dual wielding would have helped with that, since they’ve has been a desired features for quite a long time. Many ague that its a waste of resources and its hard to balance. What I haven’t seen a lot of people talk about is the existence of Social vs Ranked playlists. What I mean by this is, although ranked is great and you to flex your skills. Social game types help ppl lay back and have fun without worry of sweating. This is where dual wielding and playable elites come in. - Dual wielding can be in: Campaign, Social Playlists, Firefight, and Custom Games. While Playable Elites can be in: Social playlists/Invasion, Firefight, Campaign DLC, and custom games. This is not a waste of resources nor would be so hard to balance, for example you could have certain weapons be duel wieldable with dmg tweaked for the playlists. - Without making this post too long, I disagree heavily with 343i decision and excuse we were given for playable elites and not having duel wielding. A “spartan story” is what led me to believe that too much time is going into the Campaign. - On a side note I don’t use playable elites and dual wielding was something I mainly used in campaign. Its just with the time 343i has had with this game I don’t think its wrong to expect a game with a lot of features. - One more thing: I also don’t see many people talking about how 343i are redesigning weapons, removing and replacing weapons as a waste of resources but playable elites and dual wielding are.
We haven’t heard anything about MP yet so really you’re just speculating on the resources front. We know last year that there was some discussion about a split release… makes me think MP was the bit that wasn’t as ready hence we haven’t seen as much so far.
> 2533274866022405;2:
> I think it all comes down to what 343 feels will have a much bigger impact in the short run leading up to release. It would have been nice to see playable elites and dual wielding at launch but perhaps they will come later. In regards to 343 focusing on designing weapons and choosing which weapons to include in the sandbox at launch, I feel that would be a bigger impact on the game than playable elites. Elites are at the end of the day mostly a cosmetic choice, especially if their hitbox is balanced correctly, but something like how the BR or pistol will operate within the game has a much more noticeable impact on gameplay. 343 would also have to design a whole set of armors specifically for Elites, which would take resources and time. I have more hope that things like playable elites and dual wielding can be implemented after launch, especially with Infinite being a live-service game of sorts, but the reality is there is only so much time in the day for developers to do stuff. Plus I think its more important that developers can have a good work-life balance rather than being forced to work nonstop up until release.
One point to pop in this, is that the armor sets would probably just be recycled from whatever appears in campaign anyway. The real time would go into designing animations for things like using non-banished vehicles, wielding non-banished weapons, assassinations, utilizing certain equipment, highjacking, and first person arm and lower-body models. At this stage they would also have to make sweeping changes to the Elite models in general to balance them out, changing their posture, proportions, and size to fit the silhouette of a Spartan from most angles (easy if you mimic Reach’s tall-standing posture and proportions and then scale them down to a Spartan’s height and width in MP).
Basically if they decided to implement them from the start, it probably wouldn’t have soaked up too many of their resources compared to how they would of they changed course and decided to add it now, when other parts of the game simply demand more attention.
> 2533274810177460;16:
> > 2533274866022405;2:
> > I think it all comes down to what 343 feels will have a much bigger impact in the short run leading up to release. It would have been nice to see playable elites and dual wielding at launch but perhaps they will come later. In regards to 343 focusing on designing weapons and choosing which weapons to include in the sandbox at launch, I feel that would be a bigger impact on the game than playable elites. Elites are at the end of the day mostly a cosmetic choice, especially if their hitbox is balanced correctly, but something like how the BR or pistol will operate within the game has a much more noticeable impact on gameplay. 343 would also have to design a whole set of armors specifically for Elites, which would take resources and time. I have more hope that things like playable elites and dual wielding can be implemented after launch, especially with Infinite being a live-service game of sorts, but the reality is there is only so much time in the day for developers to do stuff. Plus I think its more important that developers can have a good work-life balance rather than being forced to work nonstop up until release.
>
> One point to pop in this, is that the armor sets would probably just be recycled from whatever appears in campaign anyway. The real time would go into designing animations for things like using non-banished vehicles, wielding non-banished weapons, assassinations, utilizing certain equipment, highjacking, and first person arm and lower-body models. At this stage they would also have to make sweeping changes to the Elite models in general to balance them out, changing their posture, proportions, and size to fit the silhouette of a Spartan from most angles (easy if you mimic Reach’s tall-standing posture and proportions and then scale them down to a Spartan’s height and width in MP).
>
> Basically if they decided to implement them from the start, it probably wouldn’t have soaked up too many of their resources compared to how they would of they changed course and decided to add it now, when other parts of the game simply demand more attention.
Thank you! If they had the intentions from the start it wouldn’t have been that big of a deal.
> 2533274874872263;15:
> > 2533274902469708;1:
> >
>
> We haven’t heard anything about MP yet so really you’re just speculating on the resources front. We know last year that there was some discussion about a split release… makes me think MP was the bit that wasn’t as ready hence we haven’t seen as much so far.
If it isnt ready yet and its to be released this year, that would be very concerning. But one of the points I was making is that the community more than 343i has sad that certain things would be a waste of resources.
> 2533274902469708;12:
> > 2535419263744226;5:
> >
>
> We don’t need a decent Multiplayer, we need an excellent multiplayer. That’s what holds player counts far longer than the campaign, like I said before I’ve played a lot of campaign. I even played a decent amount of Halo 4 campaign and I didn’t even enjoy it as much as titles before it. But Halo 4 numbers dropped due to its multiplayer. Will 343i story really be worth 60 bucks now that the multiplayer is free? I don’t think so honestly.
We also need an excellent story just as much as we need an excellent multiplayer. Many people despise Halo 5 despite having a good multiplayer and that’s because they hated the story.
Infinite might be worth 60 bucks. However so are The Last Of Us 2, God of War, and Red Dead 2 despite some of those games having multiplayer. They justify the $60 price tag because all had comprehensive storytelling experiences. Stories that challenge the way we think and potentially change lives.
Halo 2 did the same back in 2004. Halo 4 had a complex relationship between Chief and Cortana that could’ve been more fleshed out. The fact that it’s $60 while the multiplayer is free makes me happy that we might potentially get an amazing narrative experience.