343 taking 2 steps forward, leaps backwards

Games Other Halo
1

As the title reads. Why do I say that? Because it seems obvious. Hear me out.

-343 takes 2 steps forward and a leap backwards.
When Halo 4 was revealed, tell me what you thought it would be? What did you expect? I expected everything from previous games coming over with even new additions to make the game spectacular. Instead, they added many things, but also removed many things for no reason. Why? Why take things out in the first place?

UNSC Flying vehicle
I know this has been discussed many times, but why remove it from the game at all? Hornet was awesome in Halo 3 and the Falcon was even better. I thought the Falcon was balanced, it wasn’t overpowered in the slightest if you ask me. If they removed it for balance reason, then they should have tweaked it, not removed it entirely. I see NO reason why not to incorporate a vehicle (that was already incorporated into the engine that they use) that many people loved. You could have even replaced it with something better! People have been begging for a pelican. Why not incorporate it in MM and Customs instead of giving us one flying vehicle to go off of that will get very stale very fast? Even if it is not included in Multiplayer, it will still be fine to use in Custom games. Speaking of custom games…

Customization (or lack there of)
Though Custom gamers might be the minority in todays gaming community, we are still very prominent. With that said, why give is less than what we had before? As other topics have stated, there are hardly any options to toggle things that would be very important for custom games. I won’t get into the details as there are plenty of other topics detailing them better than I could.

Infection
If you look in custom games of Halo 3 and Reach, Well over half of them utilize the infection variant. Having Flood mode is awesome, but is EXTREMELY lacking. So many custom games cannot be recreated with the lack of options you give us. I don’t care if “Flood mode” Looks cooler than infection did in other games. Aesthetics < Customization options. Giving the flood only a sword and no other weapon? Not allowing them to drive vehicles? these could EASILY have been fixed and integrated. Why are you taking giant leaps backwards 343? Why are you not integrating important parts of the game?

Removing fun gametypes
This is a less of a complaint, but removing VIP, Invasion, Race, Headhunter, and Juggernaut is just sad. The more gametypes, the better. So why remove gametypes that have been in quite a few games prior?

Ranking system
I know this is a touchy topic on these forums, so I apologize if I offend anyone.
Halo 2 is arguably the best Halo online experience. If this is true in most cases, why would NOT want to be more like the successful game of the franchise? If not that, halo 3 was and I think the Ranked and Social playlist fit the game perfectly. Why not just split the 2 up? It worked fine in Halo 3. Many people argue that ranking system in halo 2 and 3 were flawed. Well I have a tip for you. If something doesn’t work, maybe you can tweak it and fix the problems instead of throwing it away. The people who want the ranking system back want it for competitive play. The people who don’t want it back say you shouldn’t care about a number. But if you don’t care about a number, then why do you not want it back? If you don’t care, then ranking should not affect you! But for those who do care and want something to work for other than some experience bar and a new armor piece, please just listen to us, your fans who want to love the game and don’t want it to get stale.

Conclusion
343, I am a huge Halo fan and I really do want to love Halo 4. But with all of these things left out, I can’t help but say its hard not to be disappointed. I was REALLY excited until about a month ago when you started to release all the information about what you did not include that I assumed was permanently ingrained in Halo’s design. I will be buying your game, and i will probably enjoy it for a little while, but it will probably result just like Reach did for me, which is something I never wanted to see happen to another Halo game. I am giving you game a chance, and I hope I eat my words.

A disappointed fan,
Critical

2

facepalm

PeacE
ShadEO9

3

> facepalm
>
>
>
> PeacE
> ShadEO9

Wow what an informative contribution to this thread.

/end sarcasm

4

i’ll try to answer as completely as possible

  1. i don’t miss having a unsc flying vehicle because let’s be honest they pretty much suuuuuuuck

the hornet WAS awesome why ? because it was overpowered in both flight speed and firepower
the falcon on the other hand is utter crap for the most part…it’s basically a free triple kill flying around…i’ve rarely seen anyone dominate a game or even use it very effectively…

  1. I can’t really empathize with the customs community because i mainly found those games boring and annoying but maybe 343 wanted to use resources on other things ? im sure the custom gamers will survive

  2. seriously I would be deeply appreciative if you would refrain from speaking. about flood…for years people have been begging to be flood and they get what they ask for then just whine about it…get over it.

  3. The reason for not having a TON of playlists is tied to matchmaking/skill and is a quality over quantity kinda deal. It will give playlists a denser population THEREFORE making skill based matching better quality so it’s not like reach where a bunch of recruits/commanders have to go against nobles and higher…im sure they’ll add other playlists but im happy getting better quality matches vs 36446454 diff playlists to pick from and then end up unfairly matched because of lower population choices.

  4. I’m personally okay with no visible rank…all it does is ACTIVELY encourage cheating/boosting/account selling/deranking…ALL of which ruin the experience for others and it also turns into an epeen to bully other people and just bring down the enjoyment for other people. do i like having challenging,intense and white knuckle close matches ? absolutely ! do i like raging -Yoinks!- screaming about their epeen when they win/lose ? no not so much.

5

You seem to not even know what playlists are in the game. I stopped reading after that. SWAT is in the game. If you don’t even know what you’re talking about then I have no reason to listen to the rest of the argument. Though I’ll assume that there will be ways to customize flood mode and you along with others are just jumping the gun.

6

ZOMG PEOPLE DO NOT KNOW HOW AWZUM I AM…

please…

7

> > facepalm
> >
> >
> >
> > PeacE
> > ShadEO9
>
> Wow what an informative contribution to this thread.
>
> /end sarcasm

Youre welcome!

Sadly i don’t agree with your opinion, And if i decided to sit here and start my reasons as to why i’d be here for a very long time.

PeacE
ShadEO9

8

> i’ll try to answer as completely as possible
>
> 1. i don’t miss having a unsc flying vehicle because let’s be honest they pretty much suuuuuuuck
>
> the hornet WAS awesome why ? because it was overpowered in both flight speed and firepower
> the falcon on the other hand is utter crap for the most part…it’s basically a free triple kill flying around…i’ve rarely seen anyone dominate a game or even use it very effectively…
>
> 2. I can’t really empathize with the customs community because i mainly found those games boring and annoying but maybe 343 wanted to use resources on other things ? im sure the custom gamers will survive
>
> 3. seriously I would be deeply appreciative if you would refrain from speaking. about flood…for years people have been begging to be flood and they get what they ask for then just whine about it…get over it.
>
> 4. The reason for not having a TON of playlists is tied to matchmaking/skill and is a quality over quantity kinda deal. It will give playlists a denser population THEREFORE making skill based matching better quality so it’s not like reach where a bunch of recruits/commanders have to go against nobles and higher…im sure they’ll add other playlists but im happy getting better quality matches vs 36446454 diff playlists to pick from and then end up unfairly matched because of lower population choices.
>
> 5. I’m personally okay with no visible rank…all it does is ACTIVELY encourage cheating/boosting/account selling/deranking…ALL of which ruin the experience for others and it also turns into an epeen to bully other people and just bring down the enjoyment for other people. do i like having challenging,intense and white knuckle close matches ? absolutely ! do i like raging -Yoinks!- screaming about their epeen when they win/lose ? no not so much.

1: Just because you or someone else sucks at flying/shooting/using it doesn’t mean it sucks. And friend and I could easily wreck an entire team with it.

2: Just because you found them boring does not mean other do. The Custom game community is large and many people are disappointed with it. just because you aren’t doesn’t mean its not a big deal.

3: Why would you want a simple visual upgrade is it means scrapping almost everything that infection meant before it? Its a downgrade with a new coat of paint.

4: Like I said, playlist was a smaller complaint, but Double team and SWAT were probably a couple of the most popular gametypes in the game. Removing was a very stupid move.

5: the visible ranking system was flawed in previous games but tat doesn’t mean it can’t be fixed which is one of my main points. Deranking and Boosting can be fixed. Selling accounts does not affect you, so I don’t see why you even care. Ranking system gives players something to work for and achieve. Simple experience bar is simply how long you have played the game, how is that fun? What goal is there? At least with ranks you had something to work for other than a dumb helmet.

9

Not really. I would say a lot of steps forward, however a few important steps back.

10

> You seem to not even know what playlists are in the game. I stopped reading after that. SWAT is in the game. If you don’t even know what you’re talking about then I have no reason to listen to the rest of the argument. Though I’ll assume that there will be ways to customize flood mode and you along with others are just jumping the gun.

Really? SWAT was not in the list on the bulletin, now has it been confirmed. Until they add it to the list or confirm it, I think it is safe to say its not in the game until the next title update. When that is, I don’t care, but it should be incorporated in the game on launch.

11

> > i’ll try to answer as completely as possible
> >
> > 1. i don’t miss having a unsc flying vehicle because let’s be honest they pretty much suuuuuuuck
> >
> > the hornet WAS awesome why ? because it was overpowered in both flight speed and firepower
> > the falcon on the other hand is utter crap for the most part…it’s basically a free triple kill flying around…i’ve rarely seen anyone dominate a game or even use it very effectively…
> >
> > 2. I can’t really empathize with the customs community because i mainly found those games boring and annoying but maybe 343 wanted to use resources on other things ? im sure the custom gamers will survive
> >
> > 3. seriously I would be deeply appreciative if you would refrain from speaking. about flood…for years people have been begging to be flood and they get what they ask for then just whine about it…get over it.
> >
> > 4. The reason for not having a TON of playlists is tied to matchmaking/skill and is a quality over quantity kinda deal. It will give playlists a denser population THEREFORE making skill based matching better quality so it’s not like reach where a bunch of recruits/commanders have to go against nobles and higher…im sure they’ll add other playlists but im happy getting better quality matches vs 36446454 diff playlists to pick from and then end up unfairly matched because of lower population choices.
> >
> > 5. I’m personally okay with no visible rank…all it does is ACTIVELY encourage cheating/boosting/account selling/deranking…ALL of which ruin the experience for others and it also turns into an epeen to bully other people and just bring down the enjoyment for other people. do i like having challenging,intense and white knuckle close matches ? absolutely ! do i like raging -Yoinks!- screaming about their epeen when they win/lose ? no not so much.
>
> 1: Just because you or someone else sucks at flying/shooting/using it doesn’t mean it sucks. And friend and I could easily wreck an entire team with it.
>
> 2: Just because you found them boring does not mean other do. The Custom game community is large and many people are disappointed with it. just because you aren’t doesn’t mean its not a big deal.
>
> 3: Why would you want a simple visual upgrade is it means scrapping almost everything that infection meant before it? Its a downgrade with a new coat of paint.
>
> 4: Like I said, playlist was a smaller complaint, but Double team and SWAT were probably a couple of the most popular gametypes in the game. Removing was a very stupid move.
>
> 5: the visible ranking system was flawed in previous games but tat doesn’t mean it can’t be fixed which is one of my main points. Deranking and Boosting can be fixed. Selling accounts does not affect you, so I don’t see why you even care. Ranking system gives players something to work for and achieve. Simple experience bar is simply how long you have played the game, how is that fun? What goal is there? At least with ranks you had something to work for other than a dumb helmet.

Funny how your counter-argument here is that “Just because you think X/Y/Z doesn’t make it fact.” You do realize the entire thread was started on YOUR opinions? Just because you think your opinions are correct doesn’t make them fact. FACT.

EDIT:

Also, Doubles and SWAT weren’t in 3 at launch either. Correct me if I’m wrong.

12

Somethings just need to be changed. I personally think this is going to be a great game when it comes out.

13

> facepalm
>
>
>
> PeacE
> ShadEO9

How did you get Community member of the Week? Don’t post anything if you don’t like people expressing their opinions.

14

> > Funny how your counter-argument here is that “Just because you think X/Y/Z doesn’t make it fact.” You do realize the entire thread was started on YOUR opinions? Just because you think your opinions are correct doesn’t make them fact. FACT.
>
> You have a point, but realize that many people on this forums page feel the same way that I do, and it seems 343 is just ignoring their community. Can you tell me one thing 343 has incorporated that the fans requested be in the game? People say they listen to the community, but I hardly see them do anything for it. My question is why remove anything? Clearly people wanted vehicles, gametypes, ranked system, etc back and they just ignored us. Maybe they ignore their community and cater to CoD crowd, maybe they planned on this stuff and the game was set for release to early, but I think we at least deserve some feedback from them.

15

> > > i’ll try to answer as completely as possible
> > >
> > > 1. i don’t miss having a unsc flying vehicle because let’s be honest they pretty much suuuuuuuck
> > >
> > > the hornet WAS awesome why ? because it was overpowered in both flight speed and firepower
> > > the falcon on the other hand is utter crap for the most part…it’s basically a free triple kill flying around…i’ve rarely seen anyone dominate a game or even use it very effectively…
> > >
> > > 2. I can’t really empathize with the customs community because i mainly found those games boring and annoying but maybe 343 wanted to use resources on other things ? im sure the custom gamers will survive
> > >
> > > 3. seriously I would be deeply appreciative if you would refrain from speaking. about flood…for years people have been begging to be flood and they get what they ask for then just whine about it…get over it.
> > >
> > > 4. The reason for not having a TON of playlists is tied to matchmaking/skill and is a quality over quantity kinda deal. It will give playlists a denser population THEREFORE making skill based matching better quality so it’s not like reach where a bunch of recruits/commanders have to go against nobles and higher…im sure they’ll add other playlists but im happy getting better quality matches vs 36446454 diff playlists to pick from and then end up unfairly matched because of lower population choices.
> > >
> > > 5. I’m personally okay with no visible rank…all it does is ACTIVELY encourage cheating/boosting/account selling/deranking…ALL of which ruin the experience for others and it also turns into an epeen to bully other people and just bring down the enjoyment for other people. do i like having challenging,intense and white knuckle close matches ? absolutely ! do i like raging -Yoinks!- screaming about their epeen when they win/lose ? no not so much.
> >
> > 1: Just because you or someone else sucks at flying/shooting/using it doesn’t mean it sucks. And friend and I could easily wreck an entire team with it.
> >
> > 2: Just because you found them boring does not mean other do. The Custom game community is large and many people are disappointed with it. just because you aren’t doesn’t mean its not a big deal.
> >
> > 3: Why would you want a simple visual upgrade is it means scrapping almost everything that infection meant before it? Its a downgrade with a new coat of paint.
> >
> > 4: Like I said, playlist was a smaller complaint, but Double team and SWAT were probably a couple of the most popular gametypes in the game. Removing was a very stupid move.
> >
> > 5: the visible ranking system was flawed in previous games but tat doesn’t mean it can’t be fixed which is one of my main points. Deranking and Boosting can be fixed. Selling accounts does not affect you, so I don’t see why you even care. Ranking system gives players something to work for and achieve. Simple experience bar is simply how long you have played the game, how is that fun? What goal is there? At least with ranks you had something to work for other than a dumb helmet.
>
> Funny how your counter-argument here is that “Just because you think X/Y/Z doesn’t make it fact.” You do realize the entire thread was started on YOUR opinions? Just because you think your opinions are correct doesn’t make them fact. FACT.
>
> EDIT:
>
> Also, Doubles and SWAT weren’t in 3 at launch either. Correct me if I’m wrong.

Doubles was in Halo 3 at launch.

16

> > > Funny how your counter-argument here is that “Just because you think X/Y/Z doesn’t make it fact.” You do realize the entire thread was started on YOUR opinions? Just because you think your opinions are correct doesn’t make them fact. FACT.
> >
> > You have a point, but realize that many people on this forums page feel the same way that I do, and it seems 343 is just ignoring their community. Can you tell me one thing 343 has incorporated that the fans requested be in the game? People say they listen to the community, but I hardly see them do anything for it. My question is why remove anything? Clearly people wanted vehicles, gametypes, ranked system, etc back and they just ignored us. Maybe they ignore their community and cater to CoD crowd, maybe they planned on this stuff and the game was set for release to early, but I think we at least deserve some feedback from them.
>
> Yeah you’re correct. I can’t remember people wanting perks and the like, but they added them anyway, what a poor decision as every game with perks is unbalanced in some way or another.

17

> Removing fun gametypes
> This is a less of a complaint, but removing VIP, Invastion, SWAT, Double Team, and Juggernaut is just sad. The more gametypes, the better. So why remove gametypes that have been in quite a few games prior?
>
> A disappointed fan,
> Critical

A lot of these, if not all of these are going to be added post launch.

What you see at the moment is no where near the amount of playlists they have in store for Halo 4 Matchmaking.

How much more is there when it comes to Halo 4 multiplayer?
Kevin Franklin says;
“Oh, tons. I wish I could talk more about it now. I think we’ve only shown off about half the complete War Games experience. What excites me even more is that right now we’re preparing even more for post launch, so we’re going to have lots of returning favorites come back post launch. There’s also even more new content coming. I think that you’re going to be very pleasantly surprised. I wish I could talk more about it, but there’s tons more coming.”

18

> > Removing fun gametypes
> > This is a less of a complaint, but removing VIP, Invastion, SWAT, Double Team, and Juggernaut is just sad. The more gametypes, the better. So why remove gametypes that have been in quite a few games prior?
> >
> > A disappointed fan,
> > Critical
>
> A lot of these, if not all of these are going to be added post launch.
>
> What you see at the moment is no where near the amount of playlists they have in store for Halo 4 Matchmaking.

If this is true, then that is fine with me. More gamemodes the better. But keep in mind that is the least of my complaints.

19

You have a point, but realize that many people on this forums page feel the same way that I do, and it seems 343 is just ignoring their community. Can you tell me one thing 343 has incorporated that the fans requested be in the game? People say they listen to the community, but I hardly see them do anything for it. My question is why remove anything? Clearly people wanted vehicles, gametypes, ranked system, etc back and they just ignored us. Maybe they ignore their community and cater to CoD crowd, maybe they planned on this stuff and the game was set for release to early, but I think we at least deserve some feedback from them.
[/quote]
Well I’m gonna go out on a limb here and say they had a deadline. That might not be what you want to hear but it’s most likely why. They have already expressed some future updates they plan to implement (possibly) such as; clans, more playlists, further use of their TruSkill system, and more. You can take that for what it’s worth and give them time to add all of these features people like you and others on the forum desire so much, or you can accuse them of not listening. Up to you.

I’m personally gonna wear-out my copy of Halo 4 playing all of the new features they DID add and I expect will be amazing, and, if at the end of those couple months they haven’t updated the game at all, then it may be time to call in the firing-squad.

EDIT: Don’t discredit me because I suck at quoting ;).

20

> As the title reads. Why do I say that? Because it seems obvious. Hear me out.
>
>
> UNSC Flying vehicle
> I know this has been discussed many times, but why remove it from the game at all? Hornet was awesome in Halo 3 and the Falcon was even better. I thought the Falcon was balanced, it wasn’t overpowered in the slightest if you ask me. If they removed it for balance reason, then they should have tweaked it, not removed it entirely. I see NO reason why not to incorporate a vehicle (that was already incorporated into the engine that they use) that many people loved. You could have even replaced it with something better! People have been begging for a pelican. Why not incorporate it in MM and Customs instead of giving us one flying vehicle to go off of that will get very stale very fast? Even if it is not included in Multiplayer, it will still be fine to use in Custom games. Speaking of custom games…
>
> Customization (or lack there of)
> Though Custom gamers might be the minority in todays gaming community, we are still very prominent. With that said, why give is less than what we had before? As other topics have stated, there are hardly any options to toggle things that would be very important for custom games. I won’t get into the details as there are plenty of other topics detailing them better than I could.
>
> Infection
> If you look in custom games of Halo 3 and Reach, Well over half of them utilize the infection variant. Having Flood mode is awesome, but is EXTREMELY lacking. So many custom games cannot be recreated with the lack of options you give us. I don’t care if “Flood mode” Looks cooler than infection did in other games. Aesthetics < Customization options. Giving the flood only a sword and no other weapon? Not allowing them to drive vehicles? these could EASILY have been fixed and integrated. Why are you taking giant leaps backwards 343? Why are you not integrating important parts of the game?
>
> Removing fun gametypes
> This is a less of a complaint, but removing VIP, Invastion, SWAT, Double Team, and Juggernaut is just sad. The more gametypes, the better. So why remove gametypes that have been in quite a few games prior?
>
> Ranking system
> I know this is a touchy topic on these forums, so I apologize if I offend anyone.
> Halo 2 is arguably the best Halo online experience. If this is true in most cases, why would NOT want to be more like the successful game of the franchise? If not that, halo 3 was and I think the Ranked and Social playlist fit the game perfectly. Why not just split the 2 up? It worked fine in Halo 3. Many people argue that ranking system in halo 2 and 3 were flawed. Well I have a tip for you. If something doesn’t work, maybe you can tweak it and fix the problems instead of throwing it away. The people who want the ranking system back want it for competitive play. The people who don’t want it back say you shouldn’t care about a number. But if you don’t care about a number, then why do you not want it back? If you don’t care, then ranking should not affect you! But for those who do care and want something to work for other than some experience bar and a new armor piece, please just listen to us, your fans who want to love the game and don’t want it to get stale.
>
> Conclusion
> 343, I am a huge Halo fan and I really do want to love Halo 4. But with all of these things left out, I can’t help but say its hard not to be disappointed. I was REALLY excited until about a month ago when you started to release all the information about what you did not include that I assumed was permanently ingrained in Halo’s design. I will be buying your game, and i will probably enjoy it for a little while, but it will probably result just like Reach did for me, which is something I never wanted to see happen to another Halo game. I am giving you game a chance, and I hope I eat my words.
>
> A disappointed fan,
> Critical

  1. None of the maps seem optimized for any flying vehicles (other than the Banshee of course). Of course they could have just optimized them for it, but I guess they didn’t feel the need for it. It does kind of suck, seeing as how the Falcon was nice for transporting players around the map. As far as the hornet goes, I never really used it that much. There is a new flying vehicle, but I don’t think it’s going to be in MM. We also do get to fly the Pelican finally, but again, probably not in MM.

  2. I’m pretty disappointed with Customs/Forge. They copy and pasted the Reach pallet, made the objects look different, and called it good. There are some nice new features, but I’m tired of this crawling pace developers have taken with Forge. With every new game they have the opportunity to revamp the entire system, but instead they can get away with upgrading a few things, but keeping it largely the same. 343 added some cool features, then took away some, and left it largely the same as usual. Forge has the potential to be a powerful map editor, I just don’t think they necessarily care.

  3. To be fair, that’s how infection has always been. The zombies get a sword, and they’ve never really been able to use vehicles. They already have an advantage with speed and having one of the most powerful tools in the sandbox.

  4. I am sad about this as well, but hopefully the new gametypes are fun enough to make this not such a big deal. Previous gametypes may creep their way back into the game with title updates.

  5. I can’t say anything more than I agree. Though I don’t care too much about rank, I can’t ignore the fact that a large part of the community does. I do find it to be a bit fun from time to time either way. I don’t really know why it was just cast out entirely, but I can only hope their new system (or lack of it) works out. If not, it’s a learning experience for them.

All in all, my expectations for this game have been greatly surpassed so far. When I saw the first E3 trailer, I have to admit I wasn’t very excited. That may change once I play the game, or it might not. But from what I’ve seen, I’m very happy with it despite the big disappointments.