I simply ask myself if I am having fun and playing regularly. I’ve had no problem splashing money on Pokemon Go as I play that almost daily (even if just for a couple of minutes walking to the carpark). If I’m working interstate for a few days I tend to play it a lot (nothing else to do) - so I am happy to buy some incubators to hatch eggs while I am there.
Same with Halo Infinite. I don’t worry about what’s in or not in the game. Am I playing it regularly (tick). Am I having fun (tick). Would that particular item make me happy (maybe). I’ve bought the two battle passes and spent probably AU$100 in total so far. (technically $200 but over half of it is still in credits) At over 800 games I really can’t complain about the cost value per hour.
Yep. That mindset is completely lost on me. Pace yourself. Let it happen. And only go hard if and when it’s worth your time and effort (but never at the expense of burning out in a game mode you don’t like).
Then why play Halo Infinite? I mean if it is as bad for mental health as you claim, which I believe btw, then why not stick to the tried and true MCC? It’ll actually make you feel welcome as a Halo fan rather than isolated as Infinite does.
No its an incentive to pay.
The game is free.
All your points seem to from a perspective of why are F2P players being punished when the reality is they arent the paid customers are simply favoured by virtue of being paying customers.
Progression is poor across the board but obviously it favours those who pay and provides incentive to do so.
You shouldn’t expect preferential treatment when you arent a paying customer and the fact is you can turn every point around.
Example. All f2p peeps are possible customers down the line so why provided added reasons for them not to pay.
As it stands the game has provided you the entire mo suite without any investment so to be demanding more and saying the developers “hate” you because you dont get enough free cosmetics on top of your free game ultimately comes across a tad childish to be honest.
I understand being frustrated but what more are you really entitled to? The actual playable content is available to you in its entirity.
You bought a campaign for 60 not an mp suite that was clearly defined when you purchased it. You cant complain you dont get extras that you feel you deserve but werent part of the purchase agreement.
By that logic i should demand mp with every single player purchase.
You can lament the pricing but you chose to buy the game. Could have played it on gp instead. But i stead you chose to purchase the campaign and recieved that product.
You can lament pricing all you want but no1 forced you to spend the money.
Far as I’m concerned when I bought the standard campaign I deserve the full game because I supported the game. It was 343i’s choice to block content and remove it to cater to some stupid F2P mode.
Also @xXx_Mhx_Air_xXx I don’t normally talk about my conditions on here but 343i muting them is deeply offensive to me. I find this type of behavior insulting and patronizing. It’s part of who I am and 343i should not tell me that my own condition is not acceptable.
Fair, although I do disagree. If F2P games were of the same quality and completeness that games were back in the old days, then I would be totally on board. Sadly though, halo isn’t the only franchise to launch broken, buggy games missing core features that used to be taken for granted. If F2P really meant that I could play all these great, complete games for free, and pay if I want, then I would have no problem with it, but it seems to me like F2P is really killing game quality, and games are never complete now.
At the risk of going in circles, I refer you to the point I made in my original post:
After a couple years of MCC battlepasses that were free and stuck around forever, and the clear and consistent messaging from 343 that “your battlepass will never expire”, and finally the admission from Sketch in the S2 stream that the announcement that the battlepass would expire for free players would come as a surprise to players, I think it is fair to say that at best, 343 failed to control the narrative, and mistakenly misled players with their unclear messaging, and at worst, they tried to keep this as much a secret as possible without contradicting themselves so that when S2 rolled around, they could nickel and dime us free players into paying for content that used to be free.
You are correct in saying that they never confirmed that the free tracks wouldn’t expire, but it wasn’t clear and I argue that it was misleading.
“Unlike everyone else, our battlepass never expires, we’re so pro-consumer!”
I don’t recall this to be an actual quote.
You are very right; it was not meant to be a literal quote. However, I think even the paragraph you quoted from the article leaves it rather ambiguous.
Thats just plain unreasonable.
“As far as im concerned when i bought the standard burger (as advertised) i deserve fries and a drink.”
They told you what you were purchasing. If you didnt feel the product was adequate for its price your duty as a consumer was to vote with your wallet and dictate the market. Thats the role of the consumer if you arent diligent with your money thats on you.
You arent entitle to anything when the purchase agreement was clear.
You chose to buy the game just as much as 343i chose to change monetisation.
Own your choices and if its not worth your money you are free to put it intk another product.
Just because they said something does make the offer worthwhile. It’s like getting a normal burger then saying tomorrow that they’ll remove a big chunk of the meat then charge double the price of whatever’s left. It’s not just unreasonable but insulting.
They also said:
(This did not age well.) - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4ATKxz9PFc&ab_channel=FootedGhost_
“A lot of the stuff is unlocked by playing the game and only through playing the game”…they lied.
If I pay for a fully priced game and I’m dam right entitled. The only people that aren’t entitled as the gamers that didn’t buy the game at all or pay for the game in some form and I’ve had enough of people like you defending this shady business decision that may have helped killed this game. How about you stop with the apologetic excuses and actually own up to the fact that what 343i did was NOT ok. I already move onto other games because of this poor decision making of theirs.
I’m tired of excuses like yours that is not helping in the franchise in the long term.
As Picard once said " The line must be drawn here! This far, no further!"
I am fully aware that all of the business practices I complained about in my original post are incentives to get players to spend money. As I attempted to explain, I feel that what may have started as incentives have gone too far, and now actively drive people (like myself) further away from spending money. I still care about this franchise and want it to do well, and I feel that Microsoft is alienating players with their greedy business practices, hence why I am upset. Also, I dislike the business model Halo Infinite uses, and I think criticizing it is important.
You shouldn’t expect preferential treatment when you arent a paying customer and the fact is you can turn every point around.
Example. All f2p peeps are possible customers down the line so why provided added reasons for them not to pay.
You’re definitely right about this. I guess it’s a delicate balance on the part of Microsoft, to push players towards spending money by making their experience more negative, but not making it so negative that they want to leave instead. Personally I feel that their statements have been misleading and their practices have been blatantly anti-consumer, and should be heavily criticized.
As it stands the game has provided you the entire mo suite without any investment so to be demanding more and saying the developers “hate” you because you dont get enough free cosmetics on top of your free game ultimately comes across a tad childish to be honest.
I’m sorry it came across that way. It seemed to resonate well with others.
I understand being frustrated but what more are you really entitled to? The actual playable content is available to you in its entirity.
Again, you’re right. I’m not entitled to anything. However, I still think that as a consumer of video games it is important to stand up and speak for the changes I want to see in the industry, and in my favorite game franchise.
You bought a campaign for 60 not an mp suite that was clearly defined when you purchased it. You cant complain you dont get extras that you feel you deserve but werent part of the purchase agreement.
Perhaps I wasn’t quite clear. I know that the $60 was for the campaign and the campaign alone, and I feel that that price was worth it; I actually quite enjoyed the campaign. My complaint, which I probably didn’t do a good enough job articulating, was that in the past we used to get so much more for the same price, and that I’m not some moocher; I’ve still sunk money into this franchise and this game, and feel invested in it.
Thats just plain unreasonable.
“As far as im concerned when i bought the standard burger (as advertised) i deserve fries and a drink.”
What if the analogy went like this? They used to sell burgers with fries and a drink for $60, and their burgers were really good, but they changed it recently so that burgers alone were $60, and fries and drinks were sold separately?
If you really like the burgers, you’ll still buy them and think it’s worth it, but you can also be bothered at the fact that you are getting less value for your money. If it really really bothers you, then you might not buy the burgers anymore, but I think there’s a middle ground where you are rightfully bothered by the price change, but still think it is worth it to purchase the burger.
Well the first point you make still ignores any autonomy you had and passes on blame for your choices so its not really a good counter also. That happens its called inflation big macs are smaller and more expensive nowadays.
Alot isnt a unit, so faxtually thats isnt a lie.
No, no. You dont get to dictate the definition of a full game post purchsse. You were sold the thing you saw advertised and retroactively decided you should get more. Thats not how a purchase works.
“People like you”? Elaborate that.
I never defended practices i openly stated above im inhappy with the system.
Im just pointing out you are responsible for your purchase and thus are a party as deserving of blame as 5he people you are villifying
You have buyer remourse and thats entirely on you. You are not a victim flby virtue of being an irresponsible consumer.
No i did my part actually unlike you. I chose to not purchase the campaign as it felt like a bad deal. I have purchased the battle passes and will us bp2 to buy the next. I am actaully being responsible and hildimg myself accountable for my actions and not buying things that i feel arent worth the cost.
You bought the game knowing it was a campaign missing features and are the person who incentivised them keeping that monetisation going forward so the reality here is you have done more damage than I and are now acting like you are a victim.
So again. You are a person, you made a choice noone made you do anything. Dont act like your bad decision is the fault of a shady corp puppeteering you into irresponcible financial moves.
You descrided a literal thing that happens all the time and being a bad consumer
So you are incorrect there is no middle ground it doesn’t exist and cannot exist within the capitalist system the entire point in consumers is to dictate the market with their wallets. You vote with your wallet if you think something is worth purchasing purchase it. for that fair price if it isn’t then do not purchase the item by purchasing the item at this increased price you have only allowed for the market to shift against you. you have bought it you have decided that the product that you now Lament buying due to buyers remorse was in fact worth the price you paid by virtue of buying the thing. Thats the contract you engaged in and have recieved what was paid for. 343 do not have a contractual obligation to uphold everything they said in relation to free players because there is actually no contract outside of the terms of use in the game that they have signed with the other party i.e. you yes I agree it is in Bad Faith to remove that pass however the og battle pass is in fact always available and does not expire further should you buy the battle pass you will retain the experience already acquired thus your progress was not lost and in effect they have upheld their end of the bargain while I do not agree with 343 practises I also have the autonomy to make my own choices and dictate what I think is worth a purchase in this case I did not purchase to campaign because it was available via Game Pass and I did not think €60 was a fair price for an incomplete Halo campaign
Again I never stated I thought it was ok or the correct decision. in fact I explicitly expressed I felt the opposite.
I openly stated I did not purchase the game precisely due to the reasons you are stating.
The difference between you and I is I took the time to decide whether or not the purchase was worth it.
using the information we all had available to us at the time.
You however still opted to buy the product, despite not believing it to be worth the $60 Price Tag therefor you as an individual have made a bad choice. An iirresponsible financial decision.
One that has effectively told the studio it can get away with this practise in the future.
You have openly told me that you supported this problem more than I have, by openly paying more money than I have for the product. how is that hard for you to understand?
I never stated it was the consumers fault that the game came out as it is or has this type of monetisation.
I only stated that it by engaging in that monetisation, you have effectively told the studio that they can actually do it!
That it works as a system! That people are actually PASSIVE enough to pay that ridiculous price for said unfinished game.
I have not ignore a thing I simply acknowledged your choices in relation to their decisions I opted not to supported I chose to tell them with my money that I am not in favour of this system you did the opposite you support it you have encouraged this happen again this is a fact. One you can use as a teachable moment or denie and be doomed to repeat.
None of my discourse has been about the bad consumer practises of 343 because I was replying directly to your lamentation of the treatment of the free-to-play players who by virtue of being free-to-play have not paid money to play the thing advertised you are lamented paid €60 for the product that was advertised which wasn’t the multiplayer it was the single player should the TV separate no but that is a fact.
If you had engaged with me on this forum prior to this discussion, you would see I am openly against most of 343s financial and creative choices.
By vilifying another member of the community who has done less in support of these choices than you have by your own actions and admission are only creating toxicity within the community.
If you do not wish to respond that is fine just keep in mind that nothing I have said here has been embellished, hyperbolic or a lie.
It is simply fact and a fact that you have trouble accepting.
If you dont like something the only right you have as a cosumer is not supporting it.
Supporting it and then acting like you are a vixtim of malicious trickery is a fools game and the actions of one who cant accept their role in pacifying terrible auntie consumer choices being made in the industry at this time. Ultimately I wasn’t even in favour of it releasing, I was pro delay, I was happy with waiting a year or more for a finished product. Please dont label me toxic mearely due to the fact i am aware enough to acknowledge the impact my actions have and my role in the market as a while. We as individuals have lttle say but had more opted to simply not buy the game in its unfinished state your complaints would be far more genuine and be far more effective.
@ronnie42 please refrain from labeling things as bait because you cant cope and actually make a valid arguement next time please. We are all fans here and are ready to engage in discourse. The bait medal on clearly genuine comments just serves as an admission you have no good points to make and are just attempting to discredit me. Fact remains you bought the game as advertised and now want more where as i opted to NOT buy an u fi ished game and encourage that sort of anti consumer BS. Childishness and axtinf like a victim does nothing for you, other players or the franchise at large except give the community a bad name. Happy to reply i earnest should you have any real counter arguments to my points beyond the its not fair woe is me 343 bad made me buy an u gi ished product takes, you have had thus far.
When was that?
You literally said you bought the campaign if you dont own it then dont lie? Simple enough.
“Edit Sorry quote function didnt work in the initial post, please scroll the the end of this post for the quoted comment from ronnie as i am unsure how to place it here, ty”
So ya thats you being inconsistent in your own claims.
Sorry but are you saying you reported me? Or that I reported you? Im not even sure how to report people on the new waypoint tbh. Nor do I have any reason to report you. I dont believe you breached any of the terms of use and i havent seen you offend anyone so genuinely perplexed by what you said here.
343i can 100 percent see all my edits and likely the older versions of each comment.
None of them changed the content on my replies just fix up grammar and typos because i was using voice to text while exercising and it has trouble with my accent so ya i edited my comments, to make them easier for others to read.
With the one exception of replying to you after you marked my, very reasonable and straightforward sentiment as bait.
Editing typos is one of the main reasons they have the option one would assume.
Wanting to be clear is in no way an attempt to hide guilt pal.
I dont have guilt to hide.
Because im not guilty of anything.
I didnt do anything to get a response. You ARE acting like a victim.
I have nothing to hide.
You just seem to be either a failed attempt at trolling or point blank refuse to engage in reasinable discourse.
In what reality does buying the product as it was/is advertised entitle you to a seperate product?
Like sure it sucks they split them up but you knew that was the case, you werent blindsided by the new business model and you cant act like you were ripped off just because you arent happy with the mp monetisation.
When did i report your comment? Seriously I dont believe I did so and if I did it was entirely by accindent if there is a way to confirm this please share it and I will find out how to undo it because it wasnt done so intentionally if it is the case.
I have not harrassed you. I have tried to have a conversation.
You have labelled me as “toxic” and a 343i appologist but that is simply inaccurate and rather than actually engage in my words you seem to just hand wave it all away by labeling me those things.
Thats is not a counter arguement its just the online equivelant to putting fingers in your ears and shouting lalalalaalalala when someone is speaking.
Like i said im more than willing to have a conversation here but if thats not somethingbyou are willing to do i ha e already said thats ok all i asked was you stop calling my posts bait because you dissagree.
I have nothing to gain from baiting anyone i just want to discuss things halo related and have good conversations on those topics.
If you dont want me to engage you then just take your own advice and cease giving me reason to defend and or explain my position.
If you do plan to respond please define this “agenda” that “people like [me]” have.
And again i dont see how making my posts legible and not rife with multiple typos and missing puctuation can be labeled as an attempt to obscur guilt.
Lile thats litterally make no sense to me.
Please by all means relay some sort of example as to how that is the case or why changing something like,“ruor” to “for” or “play” to “pay”, for the sake of making a sentence intelligable is me making myself “sound less guilty ”
Also at least be honest the “dozens” you speak of are actually a total of 5 edits that I can see clearly here on the site.
To ensure i remain on topic.
Buying the campaign regardless of ones personal feelings does not entitle anyone to any mp content aside from the in campaign unlocks and you are not a paying customer for mp if you bought the campaign that is clearly listed as a campaign.
A seperate purchase from the mp, the F2P model was not a surprise, it was well marketed.
Obviously paying players will be given preferential treatment.
Obviously the design is intentionally made as to encourage in app purchases.
“Hating” the f2p players is not the goal its catching whales.
Paid customers are as annoyed as f2p but they are actual customers so thats the cost of being a non paying player.
This isnt a conversation on if the monetisation on infi ite is good or not.
Its about how F2P people feel they are mistreated but they arent really. The entire fanbase is being toyed with and those with the least invested are going to inevitably be treated the worse.
That said they ultimately get as much tangiable play realated content as the guy who bought every cosmetic in the store and both passes so the conplaint seems quite entitled.
Complaining about challenges and progression ect. While all valid as critique doesnt support this idea 343i hates free players its more just evidence of missmanagement, development issues and poor market research.
Trying to act like victims while openly saying you have bought a game as it was advertised but feel it should provide more than it promised or alternatively that you ha e not invested in the series isnt really a reasonable complaint and just undermines the valid criticisms being made.
Thank you for your time and have a pleasant day
anyone who reads this Odyssey of a post.
Edit2: @ronnie42 so it appears i did in fact flag one of your posts, for that i appologise it was unintentional. Likely just a result of usi g a pretty banged up mobile im afraid.
I stand by the rest of my statements but i do aknowledge im at fault on that one and have gone through the process of explaining it was an error kn my behalf as I do not wish to wrongfully cause any unfair censorship or stress on other waypoint users.
Sorry for the co fusion.
”