343 is going to ruin HALO by removing skill gap.

Games Halo 5: Guardians
#1

At the time of this post, I am an SR50, have put 4 days 1 hour into game play. Alongside a 60% win/loss and a 2.0 kda. Except, Im at 8k+ kills thus far. I’ve noticed something I couldnt put my finger on. Until now. TThe game mechanics are in play to close the skill gap. Which in the long run will ruin Halo’s longevity. Don’t believe me? Read on.

Bullet magnatism and strafing. With the introduction of bullet magnatism, your strafe has to be more pronounced. Otherwise that aggressive push 1v1 comes down to who saw who first. You cant outstrafe a head seeking bullet. So if you happen to see me first, congrats. I’m dead because I cannot outstrafe bullet magnatism. This closes the skillgap significantly. 343 tries to repair this with thrusters. Which instead leaves us with players who can’t or dont know how to strafe playing on par with players with years of strafe expierence. Notice the distance the thrusters push you. This isnt a mistake, they push you out of bullet magnatism range. Thats also how far you’ll have to strafe to stay alive except for 1 issue.

TTK. Time to kill is significantly reduced. Quicker ttk, means less time to respond to oncoming fire. So a player whose put a decade of play in halo should be in their mid twenties to early thirties. Older players have to match the twitch speeds of an adolescent teen. Which is faster? The teen whose reflexes arent worn from a decade of gaming. Which leads to…

Power weapon/power ups? indicators in an arena shooter. Map awareness is a skill in which, allows a more skilled player to understand where he needs to make a stand and when. If player A. Knows sniper spawns every 2 minutes and player B. Doesn’t. Player A. Is more likely to dominate the opposition regardless of his skill with that power weapon/power up. Which also leads to situational awareness

callouts by the A.I. allow a less than compatable team to communicate target locations without ever working together. This bridges the gap between team and solo play by removing social aspects and teamwork earned through lets say a decade of practice with your team.

crouch jump versus clamber and ground pound versus ghandi hopping. A skill gap unique to halo, by removing crouch jumping, those forign to its playstyle dont have to worry about learning it. We just ave to jump against the ledge instead of timing the button combination. Ghandi hopping is removed by mapping the groundpound to the same buttons requiered to perform these tricks. By replacing this skill gap of a lower skill cieling abillity, you lesson the overall skillgap.

Finally, hover aim, versus airbourne shooting. Both are low risk, high reward traits. Which favors the weaker player? If I have time to meticulously aim at the back of your head while youre trying to regain shields in an impossible angle without wasting precious rounds, there is less skill overall.

Headshot multipliers to automatic weapons. By introducing elements of luck, in this case ars and smg’s. When the weapon proc’s so to speak, I have no knowldge of it whatsoever. The bullet spread of auto’s are random and by addinh them, reduces the skill and comes down to who got luckier. The skill lies in who was more consistant not in, I mustve landed a lucky bullet to the dome.

These things do not make a ffun gamme to watch and have a harmfull effect not only on its longevity but to competitve play as well. Competitive play is based on skill, practice ect. We watch to learn new tricks. We play to practice those tricks by removing the skill gap, the lasting effect is a short lifespan to that game. If I can play like the pro’s why should I play at all? If I have learned all the tricks, whats to stop me from playing something else?

TLDR, every mechanic introduced thus far has an overall harmfull impact to the skillgap in HALO.

#2

I agree, and it’s also why I hate BR starts. There’s no skill in “who sees who first”, and more often than not I end up just backing out after I shoot 3 times, and then letting my team pick off the enemy.

I hate playing the game like this. It’s just a horrible feeling.

Breakout is a lot better because only 1 person on each team has a BR, but when everyone has BRs Halo 5 turns into what the MLG playlist used to be in Halo 3.

#3

> 2753093343654685;2:
> I agree, and it’s also why I hate BR starts. There’s no skill in “who sees who first”, and more often than not I end up just backing out after I shoot 3 times, and then letting my team pick off the enemy.
>
> I hate playing the game like this. It’s just a horrible feeling.
>
> Breakout is a lot better because only 1 person on each team has a BR, but when everyone has BRs Halo 5 turns into what the MLG playlist used to be in Halo 3.

Br starts are suppossed to encourage teamwork but with a low TTK, the game doesn’t support good gameplay. Also thank you for reading, iknow it’s long.

#4

  1. I’ll give you that one. You’re right bullet magnetism is a bit too high in this game. A good solution would be to slightly increase the spartan hitbox while accordingly toning down the bullet magnetism. That way you can still hit people, but it comes down to your aim still.

  2. Time to kill is high, but hardly enough to make it impossible to fight someone. If you strafe or thruster while getting shot you are very likely to best your opponent even if they shot you first. Has happened to me many times both for me and my opponents.

  3. That was more a skill of memorization. It’s like a high school history test. For the basic players it hardly matters. Pro games almost always consist of forged maps so I doubt this will make a difference for hardcore players.

  4. Many people do not use their mics these days and those that do often don’t care to use call outs. This only benefits people.

  5. Clamber can make certain jumps easier, but it also increased the fluidity of movement across the map. It also allows for new flanking strategies such as the ledge to turbine on empire. As for ground pounding and ghandi hopping this seems to be more of an issue with your control scheme and not the game.

  6. Hovering makes you a target and an easy one at that. It has its own punishments and is completely optional.

  7. Headshot multipliers have been something people have been asking for for the past year. Look up the many threads on this forum talking about it. It is a very risky thing because if you aim at the head you are likely to miss many of your shots even at close range. It punishes those that spray and pray at center mass especially in duels between autos.

It has changed the skill gap for sure, but changed and lowered are 2 different things.

#5

  1. I agree, magnetism needs to be nerfed slightly.

  2. Someone timed it, TTK is comparable to the Halo average for the BR, apparently

  3. Yes Quake has indicators as well in some of their tournaments, in the form of constantly visible countdown timers. If noobs want to rush the power weapon spawns then kill them, exploit the countdown timers and kill casuals who are trying to camp on them. Otherwise remembering the timers and spawn locations is just that: memorization. I had that worked out on the first day of playing Halo 3, it’s hardly skilfull. What is skillful is outshooting a scrub trying to sit on a power weapon spawn at 30 seconds.

  4. Fewer people use mics these days; this was something I actually recall people requesting back in the day.

  5. Am I the only one who thought crouch jumping was easy? How was that skillful? It was the easiest display of “skill” I ever saw. Though to balance clamber, I would say they should make it impossible to clamber if you mash the button; it’ll only work if you time it properly.

  6. “Low risk” yet it makes you the most obvious target in the game, and doesn’t get you very far. And is optional.

  7. I agree with this in hip-fire scenarios, because it turns close combat into dice rolls. No crit-hits when hip firing.

#6

~ Uh…what? I find it consistently harder to land headshots in this game. And no i’m not talking about people who sprint and thrust everywhere. I mean people who standardly strafe. I don’t know the proper term. All I know is I haven’t seen or done any “auto aim” headshots.

~ Can someone explain this please? The only 2 weapons that kill faster are the SMG because its stronger per bullet and the scoped light rifle shots. Every other weapon kills in the same time.

~ So you’re saying it was a fair advantage to have in the past games to have an internal clock on power weapons? No. The proper way or I should say the intended design of power weapons is to create choke points and have map control. Both of which still happen with the timer being visible to everyone. Funny how people talk about fair grounds but want to keep an unfair advantage.

~ Moot point. Both teams have the communication so it’s fair. Just because the worse team can accurately hear what’s going on doesn’t mean they suddenly become pro players. They still have to outplay you. And if it’s against your seasoned team you likely have better tactics and reflexes then them. So you’d still most likely beat them.

~ I have watched a handful of tournies and MLG matches. Both tactics are hardly used. Crouch jumping was used 90% of the time to hop up to places outside of the intended play area in both campaign and MP. So it being gone isn’t a big deal. And I hardly see how ghandi hopping is a skill. It’s just rapidly crouching in the air. It doesn’t work on anyone who can aim decently. Both clamber and ground pound leave you vulnerable. So i’d say they are both balanced. And the skill is still there on knowing when to use both.

~ Both have a good amount of risk. You are exposed more then normal. And your situation only works when you already have the height advantage. Which in that case both players could still jump and get that final shot off on someone hiding trying to regen shields.

~ Does anyone have any tangible proof automatics have headshot multipliers? Like video proof?

After all i’ve stated I will say I agree with you to a point. Certain things make certain things easier. However I will emphasis that this game has a higher skill gap imo then halo 4 and halo reach.

#7

> 2533274833380875;4:
> 1. I’ll give you that one. You’re right bullet magnetism is a bit too high in this game. A good solution would be to slightly increase the spartan hitbox while accordingly toning down the bullet magnetism. That way you can still hit people, but it comes down to your aim still.
>
> 2. Time to kill is high, but hardly enough to make it impossible to fight someone. If you strafe or thruster while getting shot you are very likely to best your opponent even if they shot you first. Has happened to me many times both for me and my opponents.
>
> 3. That was more a skill of memorization. It’s like a high school history test. For the basic players it hardly matters. Pro games almost always consist of forged maps so I doubt this will make a difference for hardcore players.
>
> 4. Many people do not use their mics these days and those that do often don’t care to use call outs. This only benefits people.
>
> 5. Clamber can make certain jumps easier, but it also increased the fluidity of movement across the map. It also allows for new flanking strategies such as the ledge to turbine on empire. As for ground pounding and ghandi hopping this seems to be more of an issue with your control scheme and not the game.
>
> 6. Hovering makes you a target and an easy one at that. It has its own punishments and is completely optional.
>
> 7. Headshot multipliers have been something people have been asking for for the past year. Look up the many threads on this forum talking about it. It is a very risky thing because if you aim at the head you are likely to miss many of your shots even at close range. It punishes those that spray and pray at center mass especially in duels between autos.
>
> It has changed the skill gap for sure, but changed and lowered are 2 different things.

  1. With the bullet magnatism, strafe just isnt enough unless you have cover to work with.

  2. while you’re right, pro teams are also given coordinates and times to the spawns, so that those players are aware of them.

  3. fair enough.

  4. Ground pound is always mapped to crouch. Check the control schemes.

  5. while i do agree with you, its debatable. Red nest on emppire is a good example, as i can see the sword and top catwalk corners. Often long before they know where theyre being shot because of target aquisition issues on the map.

Personaly, I feel a lowered skill gap overal but change is agood thought overall. Arguably a change to the skill gap is fine. But skill gaps are more like ladders and not xy axis. So a change to the skill gap, in my opinion, can only be moved up or down and not left or right.

#8

There is a clear enough skill gap in the game for it not to have any long term detrimental effects. Players good at old Halo games are good at this Halo and that’s all that matters.

there is obviously going to be a shift in which skills must be sharpened in order to elevate above others within your “skill group”. But this has always happened with Halo. Looking back to H1 and H2 where a versatile individual could dominate in nearly all situations to the days of H3 and Reach where teamwork had become more vital.

Essentially, all I’m saying is that these factors that you’ve pointed out are so trivial and have no noticeable effect on the genuine skill of players which in the top 25% (skill wise) of the player base. Anyone within the bottom 75% will progress eventually to the point where these factors are void.

#9

I believe Josh Holmes tweeted out that they were remapping ground pound to the melee button for the final game.

#10

> 2533274833380875;9:
> I believe Josh Holmes tweeted out that they were remapping ground pound to the melee button for the final game.

how would someone then do an aerial beat down/assassination?

#11

> 2661949065475413;10:
> > 2533274833380875;9:
> > I believe Josh Holmes tweeted out that they were remapping ground pound to the melee button for the final game.
>
>
> how would someone then do an aerial beat down/assassination?

Needs to be remapped to sprint or jump. Which are two buttons we dont touch midair

#12

> 2533274798011936;5:
> 1) I agree, magnetism needs to be nerfed slightly.
>
> 2) Someone timed it, TTK is comparable to the Halo average for the BR, apparently
>
> 3) Yes Quake has indicators as well in some of their tournaments, in the form of constantly visible countdown timers. If noobs want to rush the power weapon spawns then kill them, exploit the countdown timers and kill casuals who are trying to camp on them. Otherwise remembering the timers and spawn locations is just that: memorization. I had that worked out on the first day of playing Halo 3, it’s hardly skilfull. What is skillful is outshooting a scrub trying to sit on a power weapon spawn at 30 seconds.
>
> 4) Fewer people use mics these days; this was something I actually recall people requesting back in the day.
>
> 5) Am I the only one who thought crouch jumping was easy? How was that skillful? It was the easiest display of “skill” I ever saw. Though to balance clamber, I would say they should make it impossible to clamber if you mash the button; it’ll only work if you time it properly.
>
> 6) “Low risk” yet it makes you the most obvious target in the game, and doesn’t get you very far. And is optional.
>
> 7) I agree with this in hip-fire scenarios, because it turns close combat into dice rolls. No crit-hits when hip firing.

This game has lowered the skill needed to get kills, but doesn’t prevent you from being killed. By introducing more “random kills” the newer, more casual, players can feel like they’ve done something.

  • This is crazy high right now.
  • TTK is much higher with headshot multipliers and increased range of automatic weapons.
  • This I don’t care about so much, but it does seem like bloat and an excuse for teammates to never talk to each other.
  • If people want in-game callouts they should have to turn them on. Even though it says “We’ve got the sniper”, there are two on Empire and it doesn’t say which one was picked up. Not that useful in my opinion.
  • Crouch jumping is easy once you learn all of the good jumps. The point is you had to play enough to learn them. Rewarding you for spending time actually playing and learning the game. Like jumping from the top of the flag base on Lockout, down to the handrail on the ramp, to jump all the way across to the ramp to grav-lift. You had to practice that jump to hit it reliably, and you were heavily rewarded.
  • It doesn’t matter for a casual if they get killed. They want to get a pseudo-random kill from spraying an AR, to break someone else’s kill streak that they worked hard for. It just seems like spitting in the face of those who practice so a casual can steal a random kill.
  • Close range autos should never have headshot multipliers. Otherwise there is no reason to ever use melee, because the melee animation takes longer to execute than a quick spray to the face. (Backwards dash also sort of negates melee also, but meh)
#13

> ~ Can someone explain this please? The only 2 weapons that kill faster are the SMG because its stronger per bullet and the scoped light rifle shots. Every other weapon kills in the same time.

You’re wrong though.

#14

> 2533274798011936;5:
> 2) Someone timed it, TTK is comparable to the Halo average for the BR, apparently

They did time it yes, I believe the ttk in halo 3 was something like 1.58 seconds, the ttk in halo 2 was 1.46 or something and in halo 5 the ttk is 1.38 but if you think about the game this is actually recorded on non moving targets and with perfectly placed shots. With bullet magnetism and decreased effectiveness of strafing, these kills end up being much faster than Halo 3 for example where the kill time is already longer, but movement and dodging are inherent without a cheeky move like a thrusters. So in actual combat the ttk is actually much shorter in Halo 5

#15

I wonder if anyone has timed the assassination animation, with a higher ttk and sprint, assassinations may as well be a death sentence against a decent team.

#16

While I agree with everything in your post. We gotta acknowledge the BR by its own design nullifies the effectiveness of strafes in rifle battles.

The spread coupled with magnetism makes it EZ mode to hit targets up close every time. I dont know if you tried but strafing is already noticeably more effective when you DMR 1v1 somebody. Since it is a single shot gun it is easier to miss shots. Still not on par with halo Reach strafe but i enjoy when there are no Br’s in a battle.

I really wish 343i would make an all DMR playlist.

Call it ALL DMRS

#17

> 2533274798011936;5:
> 5) Am I the only one who thought crouch jumping was easy? How was that skillful? It was the easiest display of “skill” I ever saw. Though to balance clamber, I would say they should make it impossible to clamber if you mash the button; it’ll only work if you time it properly.

THANK YOU

#18

I haven’t played the game in nearly a week yet I just went 20-5 first game with wobbly aim. The game is way too easy

#19

> 2535460843083983;17:
> > 2533274798011936;5:
> > 5) Am I the only one who thought crouch jumping was easy? How was that skillful? It was the easiest display of “skill” I ever saw. Though to balance clamber, I would say they should make it impossible to clamber if you mash the button; it’ll only work if you time it properly.
>
>
> THANK YOU

SMH The crouch jumps for example from mid Lockout to sniper or from bottom mid to a base on Midship were not things that begginners or even average players could do at least not consistently. That widens the skill gap
Gandhi hopping to dodge bullets while still aiming is defitely not something that begginner or average players can do. That widens the skill gap.

God, I hate people like you who lie just to try and stand by your -Yoink- point. To say crocuh jumping doesn’t help widen the skill gap is -Yoinking!- stupid

#20

> 2533274836815839;14:
> > 2533274798011936;5:
> > 2) Someone timed it, TTK is comparable to the Halo average for the BR, apparently
>
>
> They did time it yes, I believe the ttk in halo 3 was something like 1.58 seconds, the ttk in halo 2 was 1.46 or something and in halo 5 the ttk is 1.38 but if you think about the game this is actually recorded on non moving targets and with perfectly placed shots. With bullet magnetism and decreased effectiveness of strafing, these kills end up being much faster than Halo 3 for example where the kill time is already longer, but movement and dodging are inherent without a cheeky move like a thrusters. So in actual combat the ttk is actually much shorter in Halo 5

this