343, Bungie, and Differences in Methods (Wait!)

So I wanted to take some time to address the differences between 343 and Bungie, both in how they handle Halo and their community. In doing so, I’d like to do my very best to discuss these differences as differences, and focus specifically on differences in method rather than differences in quality, at least for the majority of the discussion. It’s my hope that such a discussion will allow us to better focus and understand our own opinions on 343, Halo, and the like. And then, at the end, if we want to come out with a statement of which developer they prefer, then we can go ahead and do that too.

Now, as some background, Reach was the game that popped my Halo cherry, and I came in partway through its life cycle, so I’m not nearly as well versed on how Bungie dealt with Halo, and I’m hoping more seasoned fans can contribute that part of the discussion. That said, I was there before 343 showed up. As a frame of reference, since I don’t actual know exactly when I showed up, I started playing Reach before it had action sack as a playlist.

Okay, now, in breakdown…

Story

For starters, I’d like to specify that I am specifically talking about the story of Halo, not the gameplay of its campaigns (but I’ll get to that later). Tonally, Bungie’s Halo’s, including ODST and Reach, are rooted in being part of the larger military machine. Yes, Chief and Noble Six may have pulled off some amazing feats basically single handedly, but they still did so acting as part of the UNSC. Ever notice how much easier it is to come across UNSC weaponry throughout a Bungie Halo than a 343 one? How about how much more often you see marines in Bungie Halos? And when was the last time an ODST was seen in a Halo game? Those halos are the story of the UNSC versus the Covenant and the Flood, with the player character serving more as a conduit and personification of the UNSC than as a character (though that is not to say they have no personality, just that the narrative uses them more as a force of nature). The story of the Bungie Halos are very plot driven rather than character driven. I mean, there’s at least one Halo in each of Bungie’s numbered Halos. In 343’s Halos, you SEE a Halo in Halo 4, and that’s it. If you could have swapped Chief out of Halo 3 with a Spartan of comparable skill and capability (shut up, it’s a hypothetical), the story wouldn’t have changed. A Spartan was needed for that storyline. John-117 was not. See what I mean?

By contrast, 343’s Halos are much more about the struggle of characters in the halo universe. Characters are more important. Chief isn’t the lucky swabbie whose “You gotta save the galaxy” ticket got pulled that day, he’s the Librarian’s chosen one. He’s THE ONLY ONE who can get through to Cortana. He’s not a Spartan anymore, he’s THE Spartan. Cortana isn’t just an AI who runs sortplotout.exe and puts markers on our map, now she’s one of the central driving forces of the plot. Master Chief doesn’t fight with the UNSC because he’s a soldier anymore, he does it because it’s the most convenient option, and when it stops being convenient, “Screw it, I’ll just do it myself.” He did it in Halo 4 when Del Rio wouldn’t listen, and he did it in Halo 5. Only difference is this the second time, Lasky didn’t trust him (because reasons?) (No, bad Phoenix. Discussion of differences. Discussion of differences.).

Things happen in Halo 4 and 5 because of which characters are there. No other Spartan would have reacted to the events of Halo 4 the way John did. Had any other Spartan been marooned on Requiem, everything would have been different. It’s a character driven story. You can argue all day whether or not its a good character driven story (IMO, Halo 4 = yes, Halo 5 = No.), but it is a character driven story.

(Also IMO, if you’re going to try and make Chief a more important character, why give him five whole missions in the entirity of Halo 5’s campaign you-!)

Campaign

Now we get into the actual gameplay of the campaigns, and for the second time in a row, my having started with Reach doesn’t totally hinder my ability to talk about this, because I’ve since gone back and played every Halo game (So yay for that). In terms of level design and gameplay, Bungie’s Halos were about as Sandbox as a shooter could get. In every mission, there are countless ways to approach every encounter, depending on what weapons you pick up, what vehicles you ride, what you give the marines, and what routes you take. Yes, there were SOME linear, corridor shooty bits (especially in CE) but if you’ve played a Bungie Halo campaign. Will you use the tank to fight the two Scarabs? Will you fly around pestering it with a Hornet? Will you find that perfect natural ramp and just the right moment to jump a land vehicle onto the Scarab’s deck? Or land on it with a Hornet and take it out from inside? Will you try to drive a Mongoose with a suicidal rocket marine, die, reload the checkpoint, and then just land on it with the Hornet?

Are you going to assault the control room with a Scorpion, or a ghost? Were you fast enough to get into that Banshee before the Elite did? Use a BR to counter the jackal snipers, or just tank the hits to give the grunts a fighting chance? Do you grab the rocket launcher, or the sniper rifle to take into the next fight (Or maybe both, and let the Marines do all the pesky normal people shooting?)?

Bungie Halo levels are almost always big and open with more options than you know what to do with. To misquote Yahtzee “Just going to leave this vehicle here. Bet it’d be pretty sweet to drive around the level in it but if that’s not your thing, you know what they say, rocks are nature’s bouncy castle.”

Looking at 343 Halo levels, they were smaller and more linear, but there’s still a decent amount of Sandbox tomfoolery to be had. You can’t take Barry the Blue Barrel with you through the first half of Requiem, but that’s forgiveable. A shame, but forgiveable. Halo 5 definitely used far fewer linear, corridor shooter segments, which is pretty greatly appreciated. All in all when it comes to level design and intended gameplay, 343 seems to pretty much be aiming for Bungie’s methods here.

I’ve seen a lot of people tout 4-player co-op as a gimic introduced into Halo 5, but seeing as I’ve played through three separate Halo campaigns (Halo 3, Halo: Reach, Halo 4) multiple times while backed up by three friends, I’m kind of confused by such accusations. With the revive mechanic and the persistent AI partners in absence of other players, I kind of see it more of an evolution of Halo’s co-op than a revolution of it. (Except how the hell do you get off on removing splitscreen you-!).

And would you look at that, I’ve almost hit the character count limit, and I haven’t even got to talk about asymmetrical gametypes yet. Dang. Guess this one’s going to be a two poster. In the meantime, any other difference of method that you guys have identified?

You’ve explained this pretty well. I will always think Halo CE’s campaign as the best one, because it gives you a certain feeling that other Halo games don’t capture. I love the sandbox style of CE, with the multiple ways you can approach an objective, that combined with the soundtrack just makes the campaign amazing. One thing you’ve missed about the campaigns were the complexity of the plot. Halo CE-3 had a plot that a newcomer could understand, the story is simple, but entertaining. However, in Halo 4 and 5, the plot has become complex, in Halo 4, newcomers wouldn’t understand anything about the Forerunners. You had to read the Forerunner trilogy to understand fully what was happening in Halo 4, such as why the Didactic hated humanity so much, or the origins of the composer. In Halo 5, the story also relied heavily on the extended universe. I think that this contributes to the later campaigns straying from the feel of the original ones.

> 2533274894851836;2:
> You’ve explained this pretty well. I will always think Halo CE’s campaign as the best one, because it gives you a certain feeling that other Halo games don’t capture. I love the sandbox style of CE, with the multiple ways you can approach an objective, that combined with the soundtrack just makes the campaign amazing. One thing you’ve missed about the campaigns were the complexity of the plot. Halo CE-3 had a plot that a newcomer could understand, the story is simple, but entertaining. However, in Halo 4 and 5, the plot has become complex, in Halo 4, newcomers wouldn’t understand anything about the Forerunners. You had to read the Forerunner trilogy to understand fully what was happening in Halo 4, such as why the Didactic hated humanity so much, or the origins of the composer. In Halo 5, the story also relied heavily on the extended universe. I think that this contributes to the later campaigns straying from the feel of the original ones.

See, I disagree slightly in regards to Halo 4. I felt that even though they introduced a lot of new story with Halo 4, with the forerunner, they did a great job at explaining everything and the story was told very well; also, they had the special monitors in game where you could watch small videos that continued to unfold that story. I didn’t have to read any of the books, or go to some other website to get the lore. Unfortunately, Halo 5 did not follow suit and this title just left me feeling lost at first. Hopefully they do a better job with Halo 6.

> 2533274961306591;3:
> > 2533274894851836;2:
> > You’ve explained this pretty well. I will always think Halo CE’s campaign as the best one, because it gives you a certain feeling that other Halo games don’t capture. I love the sandbox style of CE, with the multiple ways you can approach an objective, that combined with the soundtrack just makes the campaign amazing. One thing you’ve missed about the campaigns were the complexity of the plot. Halo CE-3 had a plot that a newcomer could understand, the story is simple, but entertaining. However, in Halo 4 and 5, the plot has become complex, in Halo 4, newcomers wouldn’t understand anything about the Forerunners. You had to read the Forerunner trilogy to understand fully what was happening in Halo 4, such as why the Didactic hated humanity so much, or the origins of the composer. In Halo 5, the story also relied heavily on the extended universe. I think that this contributes to the later campaigns straying from the feel of the original ones.
>
>
> See, I disagree slightly in regards to Halo 4. I felt that even though they introduced a lot of new story with Halo 4, with the forerunner, they did a great job at explaining everything and the story was told very well; also, they had the special monitors in game where you could watch small videos that continued to unfold that story. I didn’t have to read any of the books, or go to some other website to get the lore. Unfortunately, Halo 5 did not follow suit and this title just left me feeling lost at first. Hopefully they do a better job with Halo 6.

I really hope 343 has a more classic take for Halo 6’s campaign. I’d love to see an open sandbox style of play return, as well as the feeling of being immersed in a completely alien world. While Halo 5 did this with Genesis and Sanghelios, it was only to a certain extent. I want to have those memorable moments, similar to crash landing on Installation 04 and tracing the Ring all the way up, and coming back down behind me, or being on the shores of a giant volcanic lake on an ancient Forerunner structure waiting for a gondola, looking at the giant temple in the middle of the lake where the Prophet of Regret resided. Those moments are what makes the classic Halo trilogy so memorable, and amazing, and gives it replayability value.

Sorry 343 but u should learn from Bungie s campaign story … I found halo 4 and 5 Campaigns quite boring especially the 5 “hunt the truth” in the end doesn’t have anything about the plot . I mean it was only a commercial for lure people to buy the game
ps sorry for my English but I’m from Italy lol

Story wise I find 4 rather enjoyable, but the gameplay was so linear that I can’t help but feel limited in playing the game.

5’s story was alright, and I’ve began to appreciate it more as I’ve read the Forerunner novels. However, the gameplay is far above that of 4’s, and almost every area provides a variety of ways to take on a variety of enemies. For me, halo is heading in an interesting direction, but not necessarily a bad one.

> 2535437098025824;6:
> Story wise I find 4 rather enjoyable, but the gameplay was so linear that I can’t help but feel limited in playing the game.
>
> 5’s story was alright, and I’ve began to appreciate it more as I’ve read the Forerunner novels. However, the gameplay is far above that of 4’s, and almost every area provides a variety of ways to take on a variety of enemies. For me, halo is heading in an interesting direction, but not necessarily a bad one.

I’ve noticed something between Halo 4 and 5:

Halo 4: Good story, boring gameplay.
Halo 5: Interesting gameplay, boring(debatable) and cliched story.

The only main difference in between them is that Bungie cared and loved their lore and Halo game towards their community and fan base.

343 Industries butchers and screw people who care about story and lore, whilst at least doing good multiplayer but that does not hold up what Halo is supposed to be or used to be.

Someone who started out on Reach sorry but I could not take this post seriously after reading that.

Unless you’ve lived the game and community by being part of bungies forums, community back in the day you don’t really have much idea what the differences are…

Well-said, and well-reasoned. I’m actually shocked that no one has flamed you over the fact that you’re not trying to tear Brian Reed apart.

Unlike the previous poster, I respect your opinion no matter which game you started with, and moreover, I agree with most of what you said and I started with CE in '02.

I guess that when people talk about linear game play they’re using some videogame standard that means nothing to me since I’ve only ever played Halo. To me all Halo campaigns are painfully linear. Entertaining once or maybe twice through, but not of much use beyond that. Joe Staten’s stories are one dimensional but epic in scope, his dialogue is muddy, difficult to follow, not written in the service of character development, and only seems workable because it’s backed up on every front by an entertaining story and superior production values. Brian Reed’s stories and dialogue are, to me, absolutely top form - everything good story telling can be, except perhaps having a low barrier-to-entry. But he can hardly be faulted if his stories get a little mired in lore. I’d rather see that happen than have them dumbed-down to the point that they feel like some garbage Disney Channel show. If a franchise makes it to the fifth installment then it really just shouldn’t have a story that any new kid can walk right into without doing a little homework.

Sorry you miss split screen, but it had to go. Assuming that 1080/60 has any value to you. It certainly does to me.

Keep up the good work.

bungi had, playable elites

> 2533274809693206;5:
> Sorry 343 but u should learn from Bungie s campaign story … I found halo 4 and 5 Campaigns quite boring especially the 5 “hunt the truth” in the end doesn’t have anything about the plot . I mean it was only a commercial for lure people to buy the game
> ps sorry for my English but I’m from Italy lol

I’m pretty sure Bungie wrote all of the Halo story and 343 just adapted it’s visuals/gameplay, I’m really confused why people don’t understand this.

> 2533274925429939;12:
> > 2533274809693206;5:
> > Sorry 343 but u should learn from Bungie s campaign story … I found halo 4 and 5 Campaigns quite boring especially the 5 “hunt the truth” in the end doesn’t have anything about the plot . I mean it was only a commercial for lure people to buy the game
> > ps sorry for my English but I’m from Italy lol
>
>
> I’m pretty sure Bungie wrote all of the Halo story and 343 just adapted it’s visuals/gameplay, I’m really confused why people don’t understand this.

343 has taken the helm for the story of Halo Reach. All the books, comics, games after 2010 are made by 343, including the story.