$300+ soaked into Reach and I get this?

Games Other Halo
1

No, it isn’t an exaggeration, maybe even an understatement actually. At launch I got two copies, one Limited one Standard. I bought Noble and Defiant, I bought Anniversary for the map pack, and I bought a new Xbox Slim with a downloadable Reach code bundled with it since my previous disk took a pretty bad hit and couldn’t be played. Sure, you can say I truthfully only payed 20 for the maps in Anniversary since that was just half the game, or I only payed 60 for Reach with the Xbox bundle…but I think we can agree my deep pockets for this game is a testament to how much I like it.

But now I don’t get to play the game that I payed for, not in Matchmaking. I payed for BUNGIE’s Halo: Reach. Not 343i’s butchered experiments for later use and reference in Halo 4. You know it’s true, ever since that title update got pushed into matchmaking it’s all went down hill, and when it did, the metaphorical cart being pushed down the hill toppled over itself, so now we have SUPER SLAYER instead of SQUAD SLAYER, and only ONE competitive Anniversary playlist. I won’t go into specifics but we can agree…the cart toppled over itself.

It doesn’t make any sense, either! 343i could have done what they wanted without butchering the Vanilla game that the MAJORITY likes. They could have took out Co-Op Campaign since you can still get achievements without that playlist, and pushed Anniversary Firefight into the main Firefight playlist and actually had Installation 04 show up. That’s just two ideas but I think they’re good ones.

But what does 343i do? They take out playlists that are MORE populated than others and take away the chance to get achievements also. I don’t know who told you otherwise but if there are enough players in a playlist to get a match, it’s FINE. Sure, the initial wait to get a match may be long but once you do, STAY in that lobby and it’ll be much easier. There are countless nights where I played Squad DLC with only 60 something players in the playlist, and it hardly took long at all to find a match.

I can ramble on and on and probably in a not-so-organized fashion because I’m pretty frustrated, but the simple fact is, is that the verdict is in, 343i.

As of a half an hour ago when I added up the numbers; this is what I got.

STANDARD: 26805 (5 PLAYLISTS)

EVOLVED: 12413 (7 PLAYLISTS)

Even with less variety people like what Reach is supposed to be over butchered experiments by 343i, and it has been that way for months now before this update. 343i promised players that whatever they liked they would get to play it. While this remains true, 343i disregards numbers and keeps shoving their experiments down our throat when the overwhelming MAJORITY doesn’t play it.

Standard has one basic slayer playlist where you can just go in and kill people with normal settings.

Evolved pretty much has five. Super Slayer, Rumble Pit, Double Team, Big Team, and Arena. I realize there are objective options in most of those playlists also but 90% of the time slayer is voted for.

(Big Team is terrible now anyways, it’s all heavies, all anyone votes for. It’s an okay gametype but I never get ANYTHING else. What the heck happened to GOOD community maps like Mt. Lam Lam and Wayont? Those were the most balanced maps in the playlist. Even if I will endure the settings of TU, I want to run into someone on foot every now and then, not have a ghost or revanant staring me down every freaking encounter.)

Standard lovers can’t even get variety for what they like without playing something entirely different in the Standard spectrum. SWAT or Invasion is not a variation of slayer, not really, it’s a totally different experience, even if the announcer says ‘Slayer’ at the beginning of SWAT matches.

To close this out, I just want to say that while I’m LOVING the looks of Halo 4 and what 343i is doing with it…that does not mean it is okay for 343i to experiment and butcher Reach just because it isn’t their baby, and just to gather data and reference that could be used for Halo 4 MM. That is not okay, Reach is not as fun as it used to be for the majority of people and that is a direct result of 343i’s doing. Reach was at it’s best July of last year. I fully believe people who like what they do can be able to play just that if we had someone in the MM department that has a brain firing on all cylinders that looks at opinions from all facets, MM numbers, forums, and whatever else…instead of the philosophy of CONDENSE AND OVERTAKE CONDENSE AND OVERTAKE.

Note; I use the word majority in reference to matchmaking numbers, and you can’t argue pure numbers.

2

> I use the word majority in reference to matchmaking numbers, and you can’t argue pure numbers.

You put TU gametypes in Team Slayer & put Vanilla settings in Squad Slayer, guaranteed a majority don’t know the difference.

You put Super Slayer in the Standard section and at the top and people won’t the difference.

Standard draws in many players because of the fact it is at the top w/ Team Slayer and has Living Dead.

3

Standard includes Team Slayer and Living Dead.

Team Slayer is always going to be one of the most-played gametypes for the simple fact that it is the most basic mode. Infection is the easiest playlist to both play and stat pad.

It is your fault your Reach copy was ruined, not 343’s. Also, you spent money on a console. You got a console, this is not 343’s problem. Reach is still able to be played.

4

> > I use the word majority in reference to matchmaking numbers, and you can’t argue pure numbers.
>
> You put TU gametypes in Team Slayer & put Vanilla settings in Squad Slayer, guaranteed a majority don’t know the difference.
>
> You put Super Slayer in the Standard section and at the top and people won’t the difference.
>
> Standard draws in many players because of the fact it is at the top w/ Team Slayer and has Living Dead.

I once thought this at one point myself, Moa, but I quickly realized it was wrong. With that thinking, all of the playlist populations would have Team Slayer the highest populated with it going straight down in descending order of population. This is not the case, as proved before this update. Anniversary Classic was on top and it had small numbers. Granted it was exclusive to a map pack and or Anniversary…but I think more than say, 1,500 people bought that game or the map pack, so with your reasoning it should have had more numbers.

Furthermore I’m sitting here looking at the playlists myself on the TV…SWAT has several hundred more players than TS does. SWAT is definitely not your basic experience everyone goes to. Living Dead is beating Snipers by a few thousand. Sure, Living Dead is casual-ville but it’s definitely not any Halo slayer experience like Snipers is.

Rumble Pit has more players than Super Slayer…so on and so forth. People can read. While I don’t doubt SOME people just pick the top option just because it’s the top option…Standard having more than double Evolved’s players isn’t just coincidence.

5

I think the problem here is you still expect a quality experience in Reach after 23 months of it’s existence. It’s your fault that you spent so much money on this game. Not Bungie’s. Not 343’s. So I don’t know why you brought that up.

Why did 343i do this? They are in control of Reach and Halo in general. They don’t want to worry about Reach when Halo 4 is out.

Also inb4 you send another immature message to me

6

Honestly, if they left it at around July 2011 settings or reverted back to it, it’d be much funner game. The funness of a game is NOT tied to how old it is.

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> Honestly, if they left it at around July 2011 settings or reverted back to it,

So before the TU? Where the population was even lower and Reach was made fun of a lot more before ZB/85%?

> it’d be much funner game.

-_-

> The funness of a game is NOT tied to how old it is.

Reach wasn’t that fun in the first place.

8

Go and look at my thread running the numbers. Evolved got the playlists, but standard got pretty much everything else as far as having an actual decent matchmaking experience goes. Including actual DLC coming up.

I will also say that the argument of “hurr IS AT TOP SO ITS MOST POPULAR COS PEPEL DONT KNOW WHAT THEY LEIK LOL” is a balls argument, always was a balls argument and always will be a balls argument. Absolutely without merit. The niche list of swat frequently has more than TS, and so does even BTB waaaaaay down in evolved.

9

The main game I play is Team Snipers and it is the same as yall are saying, ever since the the switch over to 343i majority of the most popular sniping stages are non-existant now and have been replaced with tiny stages that were not made for snipping (Zealot, Powerhouse, Reflection). These are all great stages just not made for snipping. I miss the maps that 343i got rid of in the Team Snipers playlist (Pinnacle, Atom, Assylum). Another thing that has come up since the take over is that in sniping you only get 2 map choices, which is fine, but when everyone votes none of the above and the next 2 maps are the exact same that is not cool.

10

I’m not into Team Snipers but I agree with you, why in the world do we have small maps for a weapon meant for long range? We need heavy weighting on maps like Boneyard, or community BTB maps. Sure, the camping may be bad but snipers aren’t shotguns, it’s meant to be tactical and long range.

Also, to the other people, all I’m saying is, is that 343i can’t even make an update to the game itself without butchering their own work up, as proven with Squad Slayer and Anniversary, and that the numbers prove the majority of players on Reach prefer standard settings over 343i’s TU. There is no ‘Alpha Theorem’ about which playlist is on top, people can read.

So if the majority likes standard, and considering standard is what the game originally was and what we payed for…why not cater to standard players in the form of more playlists?

11

> Go and look at my thread running the numbers. Evolved got the playlists, but standard got pretty much everything else as far as having an actual decent matchmaking experience goes. Including actual DLC coming up.
>
> I will also say that the argument of “hurr IS AT TOP SO ITS MOST POPULAR COS PEPEL DONT KNOW WHAT THEY LEIK LOL” is a balls argument, always was a balls argument and always will be a balls argument. Absolutely without merit. The niche list of swat frequently has more than TS, and so does even BTB waaaaaay down in evolved.

I believe I might have a counter to that little theory, Im currently looking into the Halo 3 MM line up. Initial response appears to suggest that it does not follow the “if its on top it has the most population” argument that has been repeated over and over again.

12

> So if the majority likes standard, and considering standard is what the game originally was and what we payed for…why not cater to standard players in the form of more playlists?

I don’t know if you saw my post on Fatal’s thread but I’ll sum it up short and sweet.

The reason why standard is popular is because of Swat and Living Dead(TS has the most of course but Deathmatch/Slayer is the most active in any game). Why? They are the easiest to play, win, stat pad, etc. Combined, those 2 playlists have 16,000 as of right now. Without those two playlists Evolved will be more popular and the majority on Reach especially if you add Anniversary and MLG since they use TU.

13

> > So if the majority likes standard, and considering standard is what the game originally was and what we payed for…why not cater to standard players in the form of more playlists?
>
> I don’t know if you saw my post on Fatal’s thread but I’ll sum it up short and sweet.
>
>
> The reason why standard is popular is because of Swat and Living Dead(TS has the most of course but Deathmatch/Slayer is the most active in any game). Why? They are the easiest to play, win, stat pad, etc. Combined, those 2 playlists have 16,000 as of right now. Without those two playlists Evolved will be more popular and the majority on Reach especially if you add Anniversary and MLG since they use TU.

Without those two playlist, standard would have less then half of the Evolved playlist and still have comparable numbers.

14

.

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> > Go and look at my thread running the numbers. Evolved got the playlists, but standard got pretty much everything else as far as having an actual decent matchmaking experience goes. Including actual DLC coming up.
> >
> > I will also say that the argument of “hurr IS AT TOP SO ITS MOST POPULAR COS PEPEL DONT KNOW WHAT THEY LEIK LOL” is a balls argument, always was a balls argument and always will be a balls argument. Absolutely without merit. The niche list of swat frequently has more than TS, and so does even BTB waaaaaay down in evolved.
>
> I believe I might have a counter to that little theory, Im currently looking into the Halo 3 MM line up. Initial response appears to suggest that it does not follow the “if its on top it has the most population” argument that has been repeated over and over again.

I don’t like that argument either but you got to take into consideration that the population of Halo 3 isn’t that big. The people that most likely still play Halo 3 probably know what they want to play and not just go into some random playlist that’s at the top .

16

> > > Go and look at my thread running the numbers. Evolved got the playlists, but standard got pretty much everything else as far as having an actual decent matchmaking experience goes. Including actual DLC coming up.
> > >
> > > I will also say that the argument of “hurr IS AT TOP SO ITS MOST POPULAR COS PEPEL DONT KNOW WHAT THEY LEIK LOL” is a balls argument, always was a balls argument and always will be a balls argument. Absolutely without merit. The niche list of swat frequently has more than TS, and so does even BTB waaaaaay down in evolved.
> >
> > I believe I might have a counter to that little theory, Im currently looking into the Halo 3 MM line up. Initial response appears to suggest that it does not follow the “if its on top it has the most population” argument that has been repeated over and over again.
>
> I don’t like that argument either but you got to take into consideration that the population of Halo 3 isn’t that big. The people that most likely still play Halo 3 probably know what they want to play and not just go into some random playlist.

Reach is coming up on three years old now, people know what they like about it and what they dont. People are not just randomly selecting playlist in Reach.

17

> > > > Go and look at my thread running the numbers. Evolved got the playlists, but standard got pretty much everything else as far as having an actual decent matchmaking experience goes. Including actual DLC coming up.
> > > >
> > > > I will also say that the argument of “hurr IS AT TOP SO ITS MOST POPULAR COS PEPEL DONT KNOW WHAT THEY LEIK LOL” is a balls argument, always was a balls argument and always will be a balls argument. Absolutely without merit. The niche list of swat frequently has more than TS, and so does even BTB waaaaaay down in evolved.
> > >
> > > I believe I might have a counter to that little theory, Im currently looking into the Halo 3 MM line up. Initial response appears to suggest that it does not follow the “if its on top it has the most population” argument that has been repeated over and over again.
> >
> > I don’t like that argument either but you got to take into consideration that the population of Halo 3 isn’t that big. The people that most likely still play Halo 3 probably know what they want to play and not just go into some random playlist.
>
> Reach is coming up on three years old now, people know what they like about it and what they dont. People are not just randomly selecting playlist in Reach.

*2 years

18

> > > > > Go and look at my thread running the numbers. Evolved got the playlists, but standard got pretty much everything else as far as having an actual decent matchmaking experience goes. Including actual DLC coming up.
> > > > >
> > > > > I will also say that the argument of “hurr IS AT TOP SO ITS MOST POPULAR COS PEPEL DONT KNOW WHAT THEY LEIK LOL” is a balls argument, always was a balls argument and always will be a balls argument. Absolutely without merit. The niche list of swat frequently has more than TS, and so does even BTB waaaaaay down in evolved.
> > > >
> > > > I believe I might have a counter to that little theory, Im currently looking into the Halo 3 MM line up. Initial response appears to suggest that it does not follow the “if its on top it has the most population” argument that has been repeated over and over again.
> > >
> > > I don’t like that argument either but you got to take into consideration that the population of Halo 3 isn’t that big. The people that most likely still play Halo 3 probably know what they want to play and not just go into some random playlist.
> >
> > Reach is coming up on three years old now, people know what they like about it and what they dont. People are not just randomly selecting playlist in Reach.
>
> *2 years

Ok two years old and I think people know what they want to play.

19

> > So if the majority likes standard, and considering standard is what the game originally was and what we payed for…why not cater to standard players in the form of more playlists?
>
> I don’t know if you saw my post on Fatal’s thread but I’ll sum it up short and sweet.
>
>
> The reason why standard is popular is because of Swat and Living Dead(TS has the most of course but Deathmatch/Slayer is the most active in any game). Why? They are the easiest to play, win, stat pad, etc. Combined, those 2 playlists have 16,000 as of right now. Without those two playlists Evolved will be more popular and the majority on Reach especially if you add Anniversary and MLG since they use TU.

Even still take out those 2 playlists, and those 16,000 people have to go somewhere.

I seem to remember a test, where 343 ran TU settings in TS playlists, first week, the TU got obliterated. Second week, hey we’ll change it in case people are just picking the top one. (this test was supposed to be 2 weeks) Those TU settings slayer selection on top ran 2 weeks on it’s own. I played about 100-150 games in that span and played maybe 3 games with TU settings. It’s obvious by them creating Super Slayer that the TU settings lost, and they still had to make a playlist for TU settings.

I’d imagine there would be a split where those 16,000 go, but I’d imagine a good amount would stay in Standard.

20

> But now I don’t get to play the game that I payed for, not in Matchmaking. I payed for BUNGIE’s Halo: Reach. Not 343i’s butchered experiments for later use and reference in Halo 4. You know it’s true, ever since that title update got pushed into matchmaking it’s all went down hill, and when it did, the metaphorical cart being pushed down the hill toppled over itself, so now we have SUPER SLAYER instead of SQUAD SLAYER, and only ONE competitive Anniversary playlist. I won’t go into specifics but we can agree…the cart toppled over itself.

I would rather have them experiment on Reach to make Halo 4 better rather then them now experimenting at all and Halo 4 not being as good as it can be. I’ll agree with Super Slayer. I have no idea what is the point of it. And I also agree that there should be more then just one competitive Anniversary Playlist. I bought all the DLC’s just like you and there is not enough DLC support in this game.

> It doesn’t make any sense, either! 343i could have done what they wanted without butchering the Vanilla game that the MAJORITY likes. They could have took out Co-Op Campaign since you can still get achievements without that playlist, and pushed Anniversary Firefight into the main Firefight playlist and actually had Installation 04 show up. That’s just two ideas but I think they’re good ones.

Saying that the “Majority” likes this or that does not make a good argument. There is a lot of people that like Vanilla Reach and there is a lot of people that like the Updated Reach. I for one like them both. For them taking out playlist it is usually on numbers of people that play them. All the DLC playlists did not have that many people on them.

> But what does 343i do? They take out playlists that are MORE populated than others and take away the chance to get achievements also. I don’t know who told you otherwise but if there are enough players in a playlist to get a match, it’s FINE. Sure, the initial wait to get a match may be long but once you do, STAY in that lobby and it’ll be much easier. There are countless nights where I played Squad DLC with only 60 something players in the playlist, and it hardly took long at all to find a match.

They said it themselves that taking out playlists was on a number of variables that were not stated not only on population numbers. And the idea of if there is enough people to make a match is fine, is not a good idea. It’s a waste of there server space and there would be tons of playlist still sitting there with less then 100 people in them.

> STANDARD: 26805 (5 PLAYLISTS)
>
> EVOLVED: 12413 (7 PLAYLISTS)
>
> Even with less variety people like what Reach is supposed to be over butchered experiments by 343i, and it has been that way for months now before this update. 343i promised players that whatever they liked they would get to play it. While this remains true, 343i disregards numbers and keeps shoving their experiments down our throat when the overwhelming MAJORITY doesn’t play it.

These are your numbers. 343i has their graphs and numbers too and they stated their is a number of reasons why they are experimenting and changing Halo Reach. For the most part it is to make Halo 4 a better matchmaking experience and I would rather them experiment and make Halo 4 as good as they can.

> (Big Team is terrible now anyways, it’s all heavies, all anyone votes for. It’s an okay gametype but I never get ANYTHING else. What the heck happened to GOOD community maps like Mt. Lam Lam and Wayont? Those were the most balanced maps in the playlist. Even if I will endure the settings of TU, I want to run into someone on foot every now and then, not have a ghost or revanant staring me down every freaking encounter.)

That’s based on personal experience. I have had times where there is no one voting for heavies and I’ve had times where the majority votes heavies. And Mt. Lam Lam and Wayont them being “good” is based on YOUR opinion. Lam Lam was boring for me and I do not even remember Wayont. So that goes to say that Wayont did not give a remember able experience.

> To close this out, I just want to say that while I’m LOVING the looks of Halo 4 and what 343i is doing with it…that does not mean it is okay for 343i to experiment and butcher Reach just because it isn’t their baby, and just to gather data and reference that could be used for Halo 4 MM. That is not okay, Reach is not as fun as it used to be for the majority of people and that is a direct result of 343i’s doing. Reach was at it’s best July of last year. I fully believe people who like what they do can be able to play just that if we had someone in the MM department that has a brain firing on all cylinders that looks at opinions from all facets, MM numbers, forums, and whatever else…instead of the philosophy of CONDENSE AND OVERTAKE CONDENSE AND OVERTAKE.
>
>
> Note; I use the word majority in reference to matchmaking numbers, and you can’t argue pure numbers.

You can argue with “pure numbers” because these “pure numbers” are your numbers and you have a biased and so does everyone else. Your “pure numbers” are biased. And the word “majority” used in your paragraphs is perceived on these “pure numbers” so that too is biased and just purely based on YOUR numbers.